Hya Dave - yes that’s what we’re presently discussing. A new website with lots of this on it. As with any of our projects we could do with advice and assistance on creating this - feel free to get in touch if you think you’d like to do this for love and maybe a small amount of money.
Clint (GM)
Oh, good, I’m not the only one. 
My waffling is where to direct my software development time. I have a game I’m working on that will take a long time to finish, or I could help ME Games along, which, while taking quite some time, will probably take less time than the other game.
Decisions, decisions.
Heh. For me, if there was any compensation to be had, I’d be glad to take it in the form of ME Games Account credits.
(Heh. Then I might be able to play a whole grudge team by myself.)
Not to me.
Regarding your redesign notes, I agree they would be nice to work on, but you’re talking about a much deeper dip into the well of time than I want to spend.
My primary goal is to get away from these canned strategies. Everybody knows the best opening moves for each Nation (or at least what two or three work best depending on the overall strategy to be employed).
In a word: B-O-R-I-N-G
I want a game where a strategy that takes 20-40 turns to develop has a chance to win. I want a game where many, many approaches can be used because of the extra time it takes to play the game.
In general, I want the unknowns back.
Anything that does not support this goal is secondary or later on my priority list.
I know ME Games can edit the hexes on the map – they’ve done it in a game of mine.
I know they can move Characters around, add new ones, change attributes, etc. They’ve done that.
So randomizing the map is a pretty easy thing to accomplish. No redesign work needed EXCEPT FOR THE BEHAVIOR OF DRAGONS AND ARTIFACTS.
However, knowing almost precisely where to go to get which dragons, and knowing precisely what to do to garner their support in every case, takes away from the mystery, risk and fun of this game for me.
So I’m willing to spend some time redesigning that component. That does NOT mean I’m eager to tear into redesign work for other purposes.
I am, however, willing to spend some time redesigning how the Artifact information is obtained, should that require more than randomizing a database at the start of the game, because that, too, is in perfect alignment with my goals.
Agreed. But I wanted something that could be implemented quickly, so I was trying to limit the scope of my initial interest research.
Part of the problem, you see, is that I am not certain how many people would actually be interested in those changes. While the tone of Ed’s complaints may be a bit irksome, he raises many valid points in his argument. One point he raises says, in so many words, that maybe most gamers don’t like too many unknowns. If that is true, then maybe there are less than 25 of us out here who would like to see the randomizations.
So, for my money, if there’s not enough interest in the randomizations, I have very little interest in fixing the detailed inner game mechanics if all it means is that the rules are more realistic while we keep playing out the same old 15-20 turn games with the same boring formulaic options.
But if there is interest in the randomization sufficient to get ME Games’ interest in offering it, then I could work on that project. If afterwards we also fix these game mechanics issues that seem nonsensical or broken, that’s just bonus duty.
You list all the same stuff I’d like to have. Except I’d rather it be a local PC client program like Palantir is, with the web-interface being an optional add-on later.
One interesting note is that if the map is randomized every game, a new client App would have to be written anyway. I’m betting Palantir has a lot of static data in it that can’t be fixed simply by giving it a new data file.
If I’m right about that, then a whole new client App will be necessary to at least show the map.
That’s a huge can of worms, since we would be starting that more or less from scratch, and it would be a bit foolish to not include all the killer client App features you and I would love to see.
Regarding other people not liking the changes because they like the pen-and-paper approach, one nice thing is that offering these new scenarios does not take away the ability to offer the old ones…unless too many players move to the new ones.
C’est la vie.
I wholeheartedly agree.
Steven,
one of the reasons that I want it to be web based is to facilitate collaboration by the team. If one player has their moves already in, they would show up in one of the views for the UI. Another is that it eliminates the version/support issue. There’s only one version: that which is being run on the host website. Remembering the “low margin” issue, providing a low-support-cost approach is ideal to help make the business successful.
I suspect the reason you don’t want it to be web based may be that you’d like to be able to work offline, and you’d like to have it work well even if there’s limited or spotty bandwidth. Neither of these objections should preclude the UI tool from being web based. There are some amazing things being done these days with game architectures & the web. Most aren’t yet on the market…
But again, your point may well be take baby steps before giant leaps. I guess I’m to the point that I believe the baby steps are palantir, meow, etc. and the next step is the giant leap.
cheers,
Dave
Interesting; you and I have a like mind for features. The one exception to my non-web stance was the team moves update feature, but I thought my novellette had gone long enough and I left that out.
I had already begun work on a team client App which would permit orders to be entered via the GUI and uploaded to a team repository. That way we could check for mistakes like trying to join a Company whose Commander was from another Nation and that Nation hasn’t upgraded relations yet, etc.
Although your point about version currency is one I hadn’t given sufficient consideration.
Hmm…
Forgive a stupid question, I am a computer illiterate. What are the chances of ‘technical intelligence’ hacking into these programs and obtaining data on the enemy?
An idea to note for Steve’s original post:
Leave the arty/dragon names, just randomize attributes/responses, etc.
How about, instead of FA style nation creation, a set number of identical nations with SNA’s randomized. Agree to play and you get a nation in the mail. To customize, the nation details can be forwarded to the players and personalized names can be sent back to create the actual pdf’s and get the game going.
Or instead, NO SNA’s. Name and train and build and fight according to your own personal style starting from the same place (geographic/strategic circumstances notwithstanding…).
Brad
I can’t imagine anyone doing so, really, can’t…
You know damn well that according to the game you prefer, you’d LOVE to be able to do this yourself and only ask because you don’t know how to. You’re trying to protect yourself from yourself…
Brad, I know and use Humint not Sigint. Not thinking about the possible and thinking about the impossible is a level all game designers should keep in mind.
Edit: Now Brad, don’t be bitter. After all, I could have used Humint on you in the last Flagship Cup but deliberately restrained myself.
Are you sure you didn’t? The two of us frigid northlanders feel, quite rightly so, that something odd was happening in the swamp that game…
If you are not already paranoid this game will make you that way.
I only lock my doors at home if you haven’t posted in the last 24 hours…
This thread is great! both informative 
and thought provoking 
and now its getting quite hilarious too! 
Humint and Sigint have no rightful place in MEPBM! :mad:
We seek only to Confuse and Amuse…
It’s not a stupid question.
I’m a security nut in many ways. (No, I will not list them here. That would take awhile.)
If the programmer makes no effort to dissuade hackers from sneaking a peek at the data in the online repository, yes, the risk would be ENORMOUS.
What follows, like all hacking games, is an attempt to throw enough creative blocks in the way that increasing levels of hacker ingenuity fail to pick the lock in a timely manner.
Most espionage/counterespionage games consist of two phases; the one where you try to do stuff the other side doesn’t notice, and the one where you try to put so many locks in their way that they lose interest before the last one is cracked…or that they crack it only after it no longer matters.
Your question is not stupid. It is, in my opinion, the single largest risk of using a central repository for orders. To the point, in fact, where I was thinking that casual encryption techniques were likely to be insufficient.
So if you ever play my team and suspect we’re using such a program, be prepared for some serious analytical games to crack the codes.
Well, after reviewing the data, the interest, and what Clint has volunteered to me about their projects afoot, I have decided my software development skills are better used elsewhere.
So if there’s any map randomization to happen, ME Games will have to fit that into their own schedule.
Many thanks to all who provided data, suggestions, and other feedback.
Most of all, thanks to Clint and crew for working so hard to keep MEPBM moving.
Thanks: If ever you’re looking for other projects then get in touch. There’s more to life than Middle Earth - did I just say that… :eek:
Clint