2-1 Let the game end

mepbmlist
#1

Perhaps you are correct that annoyance is grounds for changing of rules, but ultimately, that falls to harley, and the players of that specific game, I would say. One of the things that I have enjoyed about harlequin taking over management of MEPBM is the fact that rather than the rules being the absolute unshakeable will of the Vaiar, how dare you suggest otherwise, each game can be made to the desires of the people playing it. Perhaps, for the sake of continued re-enrollment of players, make the base rule something obscene, like 6-1 or even 10-1, and when the game begins, send out a request to the players as to when they think it is "unwinnable". I know I have certainly met players in this game who think being outnumbered and outgunned is the ultimate challenge, and for you to whine about the annoyance it causes you to fight these players 2-1 is no different than the whining that they can do for stripping away their ultimate challenge. Let the players decide, and if they decide, they will be more likely to come back.

IMHO

-Ken

···

From: "Keith" <gnashrak@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [mepbmlist] Re: 2-1 Let the game end
Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 15:46:56 -0000

I disagree. Annoyance is certainly grounds for changing any rule of a
game. It's a game. It's supposed to be fun/challenging/etc. It's _not_
supposed to be annoying if that can be helped without ruining other
desirable aspects of the game.

The fact that this has been discussed so many times indicates that it
is annoying quite a few people. Even more reason to keep gnawing at
the problem from different angles, looking for a solution.

Keith

--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, Gavin Wynford-Jones <gavinwj@c...>
wrote:
> > Of course if you want to whine about people discussing something
> > you've already decided on, Gavin, go right ahead. :wink:
>
> I'm not whining, boyo.
>
> We've had these discussions about changing game endings ad
> nauseam. So far, in the current discussion, we've had one
> player claiming that a 2-to-1 ratio is grounds for ending a game
> and one (not me) pointing out the problems with that assertion.
> The first of the two seems to be acting out of, shall we
> say, annoyance. Hardly grounds for justifying a change in one of
> the basic rules of any game: how it ends.
>
> And, yes, I have already decided my own point of view. I do
> hope that's allowed.
>
> Gavi

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#2

Certainly the "2:1" number is negotiable. And comparing the number of
nations is not, IMO, even the best option (see my previous post). Of
course it can be decided separately for each game but, as you point
out, there does need to be a standard. However, if the
auto-termination odds of the game are different than the standard then
they should be set and made public in the game listing just like any
other variant rule, not left to player vote. IMO, it's unreasonable to
spring rules on a player after they've committed to a game. Those
players who enjoy the "pry my nation from my cold dead hands" style
can all join a game together and no-one has (legitimate) cause to
complain.

Regarding the choice of "base" or "standard" rule, it should probably
be whatever the greatest percentage of players would find to be
acceptable. That way most players won't have to worry about it as long
as they sign up for standard games.

Keith

Perhaps you are correct that annoyance is grounds for changing of

rules, but

ultimately, that falls to harley, and the players of that specific

game, I

would say. One of the things that I have enjoyed about harlequin

taking

over management of MEPBM is the fact that rather than the rules

being the

absolute unshakeable will of the Vaiar, how dare you suggest

otherwise, each

game can be made to the desires of the people playing it. Perhaps,

for the

sake of continued re-enrollment of players, make the base rule

something

obscene, like 6-1 or even 10-1, and when the game begins, send out a

request

to the players as to when they think it is "unwinnable". I know I have
certainly met players in this game who think being outnumbered and

outgunned

is the ultimate challenge, and for you to whine about the annoyance it
causes you to fight these players 2-1 is no different than the

whining that

they can do for stripping away their ultimate challenge. Let the

players

···

--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "Kenneth Weed" <watakshi@h...> wrote:

decide, and if they decide, they will be more likely to come back.

IMHO

-Ken

>From: "Keith" <gnashrak@y...>
>Reply-To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
>To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [mepbmlist] Re: 2-1 Let the game end
>Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 15:46:56 -0000
>
>I disagree. Annoyance is certainly grounds for changing any rule of a
>game. It's a game. It's supposed to be fun/challenging/etc. It's _not_
>supposed to be annoying if that can be helped without ruining other
>desirable aspects of the game.
>
>The fact that this has been discussed so many times indicates that it
>is annoying quite a few people. Even more reason to keep gnawing at
>the problem from different angles, looking for a solution.
>
>Keith
>
>--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, Gavin Wynford-Jones <gavinwj@c...>
>wrote:
> > > Of course if you want to whine about people discussing something
> > > you've already decided on, Gavin, go right ahead. :wink:
> >
> > I'm not whining, boyo.
> >
> > We've had these discussions about changing game endings ad
> > nauseam. So far, in the current discussion, we've had one
> > player claiming that a 2-to-1 ratio is grounds for ending a game
> > and one (not me) pointing out the problems with that assertion.
> > The first of the two seems to be acting out of, shall we
> > say, annoyance. Hardly grounds for justifying a change in one of
> > the basic rules of any game: how it ends.
> >
> > And, yes, I have already decided my own point of view. I do
> > hope that's allowed.
> >
> > Gavi
>

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