why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is blazing
obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
I dont understand.
or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
pro's con's etc etc.
William
William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak launch (in UK
anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided claim that
it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to increase the
income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
(possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about defending it,
they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario won't
get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made up of
individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of 2950, then
we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming community, so
it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how good 2950 is.
A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're both chess,
then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more play books
available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well debated
strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played 2950 as
well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an exclusive
club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less rude people
and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if 2950
players want to keep it this way.
Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use the same
strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and doing
some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed. Since
its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't organise, the
daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who stuck
with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving end) what
the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is better
balanced than 1650.
1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best year of
the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail 
[]
Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
<http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:
why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is blazing
obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??I dont understand.
or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
pro's con's etc etc.
auburnted wrote:
why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is blazing obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
We dont have 2950 in Brazil, but for what I know of the game, the contrary of what you said that is obvious. 1650 is much lesser random, you know your cards and you know your enemy´s. And it´s quicker, after all. If one have not the patience and mind and dedication to calculate the results of his movements, maybe than it appears to be just a ramdomly thowing of armies.
Rener
<>s
*RLCS*
Com os sinceros cumprimentos de Rener de Larte, Rhesus, Mago et coetera
ICQ- 1576257 e-mail- renerdl@uol.com.br
"Nature is not cruel, only pitilessly indifferent. This lesson is one of the hardest for humans to learn. We cannot accept that things might be neither good nor evil, neither cruel nor kind, but simply callous: indifferent to all suffering, lacking all purpose."
-- Richard Dawkins
I am not so sure I agree, with any of you. I think the real reason 2950 does not do well is because it tends to stagnate. Basically, people get so caught up in building up their characters and nations that they forget to fight. I personally pay to play this game to mix it up and I do not want to pay to build up my nation for 20 or so odd turns. Plus, I think there are different styles of play and most people who join this whole community are more into military strategy rather than character based strategy. Not to say we don't enjoy that, but rather we prefer it to be on top of the military part rather than the whole game. To be honest I think it is why many people avoid the 4th age scenario also. To much building and to put it in eloquently not enough smash. *smile*
Serra
----- Original Message -----
From: Laurence G. Tilley
To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:21 AM
Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!
At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:
>why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is blazing
>obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
>
>I dont understand.
>
>or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
>
>2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
>
>1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
>
>Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
>
>pro's con's etc etc.
William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak launch (in UK
anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided claim that
it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to increase the
income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
(possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about defending it,
they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario won't
get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made up of
individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of 2950, then
we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming community, so
it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how good 2950 is.
A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're both chess,
then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more play books
available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well debated
strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played 2950 as
well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an exclusive
club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less rude people
and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if 2950
players want to keep it this way.
Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use the same
strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and doing
some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed. Since
its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't organise, the
daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who stuck
with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving end) what
the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is better
balanced than 1650.
1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best year of
the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail
[]
Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
<http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
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------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
How many 2950 games have you played Serra? I ask because you sound
like someone who's not yet been in a good one where there's plenty of
"smash" right from the start. If "tends to stagnate" is your own
experience from a fair number of games then I will have to merely beg
to differ with you. If you're speaking from a small number of games,
and hearsay, as I suspect you may be, then I'd urge you to test it a
bit more. There are 2950 players now who will very quickly give you
the military smashing you desire if you just sit back and try to
character build.
At 12:23 18/02/2006, you wrote:
I am not so sure I agree, with any of you. I think the real reason
2950 does not do well is because it tends to stagnate. Basically,
people get so caught up in building up their characters and nations
that they forget to fight. I personally pay to play this game to mix
it up and I do not want to pay to build up my nation for 20 or so
odd turns. Plus, I think there are different styles of play and
most people who join this whole community are more into military
strategy rather than character based strategy. Not to say we don't
enjoy that, but rather we prefer it to be on top of the military
part rather than the whole game. To be honest I think it is why many
people avoid the 4th age scenario also. To much building and to put
it in eloquently not enough smash. *smile*Serra
----- Original Message -----
From: Laurence G. Tilley
To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:21 AM
Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:
>why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is blazing
>obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
>
>I dont understand.
>
>or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
>
>2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
>
>1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
>
>Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
>
>pro's con's etc etc.William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak launch (in UK
anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided claim that
it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to increase the
income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
(possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about defending it,
they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario won't
get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made up of
individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of 2950, then
we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming community, so
it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how good 2950 is.A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're both chess,
then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more play books
available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well debated
strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played 2950 as
well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an exclusive
club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less rude people
and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if 2950
players want to keep it this way.Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use the same
strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and doing
some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed. Since
its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't organise, the
daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who stuck
with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving end) what
the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is better
balanced than 1650.1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best year of
the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail[]
Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/<http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
Zero Option - end the use of primates in research[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
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games Role playing games online
Massive multiplayer online role playing games Star wars
role playing game Wheel of time role playing game------------------------------------------------------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKSa.. Visit your group "mepbmlist" on the web.
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
mepbmlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.comc.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms
of Service.------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
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[]
Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
<http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
There are battles in 2950 starting on T2 (turn 1 for the armies to
move). They are not on the scale of 1650. I think 2950 is more
complex game due to the smaller armies/economies. Character actions
are more important. 1650 is full of making the same moves that
someone else has made hundred of times before. 2950 is flexible and
allows any nation to prosper.
I think persons that likes turn-based strategy games, like Civ, MOO2
will like 2950. I think persons like instant gratification of first
person shooters or MMORPG's will like 1650.
2950 is empire building with smaller armies and more importance of
character actions.
1650 is more of a race of moving armies on to known pop centers and
taking them away from the other side.
I don't mean to insult anyone but to say 2950 is boring is off the
mark, I would have to say they do not understand the planning that
goes into 2950 and the subtlety of the game nuances.
Everyone in 1650 starts with a big club. In 2950 you start with
small club the good players turn it into a big club.
No offense towards anyone 
James
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "Laurence G. Tilley"
<lgtilley@...> wrote:
How many 2950 games have you played Serra? I ask because you
sound
like someone who's not yet been in a good one where there's plenty
of
"smash" right from the start. If "tends to stagnate" is your own
experience from a fair number of games then I will have to merely
beg
to differ with you. If you're speaking from a small number of
games,
and hearsay, as I suspect you may be, then I'd urge you to test it
a
bit more. There are 2950 players now who will very quickly give
you
the military smashing you desire if you just sit back and try to
character build.>I am not so sure I agree, with any of you. I think the real
reason
>2950 does not do well is because it tends to stagnate. Basically,
>people get so caught up in building up their characters and
nations
>that they forget to fight. I personally pay to play this game to
mix
>it up and I do not want to pay to build up my nation for 20 or so
>odd turns. Plus, I think there are different styles of play and
>most people who join this whole community are more into military
>strategy rather than character based strategy. Not to say we
don't
>enjoy that, but rather we prefer it to be on top of the military
>part rather than the whole game. To be honest I think it is why
many
>people avoid the 4th age scenario also. To much building and to
put
>it in eloquently not enough smash. *smile*
>
>Serra
> From: Laurence G. Tilley
> To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:21 AM
> Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!
>
>
> >why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is
blazing
> >obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
> >
> >I dont understand.
> >
> >or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
> >
> >2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
> >
> >1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
> >
> >Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
> >
> >pro's con's etc etc.
>
> William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak launch
(in UK
> anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided claim
that
> it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to increase
the
> income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
> (possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about
defending it,
> they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario
won't
> get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made
up of
> individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of
2950, then
> we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming
community, so
> it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how
good 2950 is.
>
> A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're both
chess,
> then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more
play books
> available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well
debated
> strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played
2950 as
> well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an
exclusive
> club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less rude
people
> and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if
2950
> players want to keep it this way.
>
> Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use
the same
> strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and
doing
> some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed.
Since
> its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't organise,
the
> daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who
stuck
> with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving end)
what
> the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is better
> balanced than 1650.
>
> 1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best
year of
> the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail
>
>
>
> []
> Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
>
> <http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
> Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
>
> http://www.buav.org
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
> To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
> Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
>
>
>
>
> SPONSORED LINKS Computer role playing game Online role
playing
At 12:23 18/02/2006, you wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
> At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:
> games Role playing games online
> Massive multiplayer online role playing games Star wars
> role playing game Wheel of time role playing game
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------
------------
> YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
> a.. Visit your group "mepbmlist" on the web.
>
> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> mepbmlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
Terms
> of Service.
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------
------------
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
>To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
>Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>[]
Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/<http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
Zero Option - end the use of primates in research[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I think you are mistaken in this comment, and are (unintentionally)
promulgating the myth that 2950 is dull. While 2950 is slightly
better, 1650 is still an intelligent strategy game. People that
genuinely prefer first person shooters, should be steered not to
1650, but into Gunboat, or out of ME all together. There are players
who come into ME looking for fast excitement, they use up their
initial armies, and are usually bankrupt, eliminated or have dropped
in the first ten turns. Better to tell them from the start that ME
is NOT an arcade game.
Furthermore I repeat my recommendation to people, to try a good ME
game. If you play against a set of competent 2950 players, you will
quickly see that it can become very much about armies, from a very
early stage. The WotR variant even puts some of the big starting
armies back in, to entertain those with minimal patience.
[]
Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
<http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
At 01:30 20/02/2006, morcurufin wrote:
I think persons that likes turn-based strategy games, like Civ, MOO2
will like 2950. I think persons like instant gratification of first
person shooters or MMORPG's will like 1650.
I dont think I am. I think your logic is flawed (though I know that
concept is hard for you to fathom) but in all honesty is not worth
trading posts over it.
James
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "Laurence G. Tilley"
<lgtilley@...> wrote:
>I think persons that likes turn-based strategy games, like Civ,
MOO2
>will like 2950. I think persons like instant gratification of
first
>person shooters or MMORPG's will like 1650.
I think you are mistaken in this comment, and are
(unintentionally)
promulgating the myth that 2950 is dull. While 2950 is slightly
better, 1650 is still an intelligent strategy game. People that
genuinely prefer first person shooters, should be steered not to
1650, but into Gunboat, or out of ME all together. There are
players
who come into ME looking for fast excitement, they use up their
initial armies, and are usually bankrupt, eliminated or have
dropped
in the first ten turns. Better to tell them from the start that
ME
is NOT an arcade game.
Furthermore I repeat my recommendation to people, to try a good ME
game. If you play against a set of competent 2950 players, you
will
At 01:30 20/02/2006, morcurufin wrote:
quickly see that it can become very much about armies, from a very
early stage. The WotR variant even puts some of the big starting
armies back in, to entertain those with minimal patience.[]
Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/<http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
Zero Option - end the use of primates in research[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Perhaps you are right. Now may be different, although I played quite a few games of 2950 it was a few years ago. If the style of play has changed, great. I have been thinking of playing a 2950 game in the future. But Laurence just to let you know I do not do things from hearsay. If you notice I very rarely comment on this list for a reason, if I say something I want it to be because I have experienced it for myself, not because I heard it through the grapevine and if I do say something based on that believe me I WILL note it.
Serra
----- Original Message -----
From: Laurence G. Tilley
To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, February 19, 2006 5:06 AM
Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!
How many 2950 games have you played Serra? I ask because you sound
like someone who's not yet been in a good one where there's plenty of
"smash" right from the start. If "tends to stagnate" is your own
experience from a fair number of games then I will have to merely beg
to differ with you. If you're speaking from a small number of games,
and hearsay, as I suspect you may be, then I'd urge you to test it a
bit more. There are 2950 players now who will very quickly give you
the military smashing you desire if you just sit back and try to
character build.
At 12:23 18/02/2006, you wrote:
>I am not so sure I agree, with any of you. I think the real reason
>2950 does not do well is because it tends to stagnate. Basically,
>people get so caught up in building up their characters and nations
>that they forget to fight. I personally pay to play this game to mix
>it up and I do not want to pay to build up my nation for 20 or so
>odd turns. Plus, I think there are different styles of play and
>most people who join this whole community are more into military
>strategy rather than character based strategy. Not to say we don't
>enjoy that, but rather we prefer it to be on top of the military
>part rather than the whole game. To be honest I think it is why many
>people avoid the 4th age scenario also. To much building and to put
>it in eloquently not enough smash. *smile*
>
>Serra
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Laurence G. Tilley
> To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:21 AM
> Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!
>
>
> At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:
> >why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is blazing
> >obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
> >
> >I dont understand.
> >
> >or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
> >
> >2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
> >
> >1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
> >
> >Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
> >
> >pro's con's etc etc.
>
> William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak launch (in UK
> anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided claim that
> it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to increase the
> income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
> (possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about defending it,
> they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario won't
> get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made up of
> individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of 2950, then
> we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming community, so
> it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how good 2950 is.
>
> A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're both chess,
> then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more play books
> available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well debated
> strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played 2950 as
> well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an exclusive
> club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less rude people
> and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if 2950
> players want to keep it this way.
>
> Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use the same
> strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and doing
> some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed. Since
> its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't organise, the
> daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who stuck
> with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving end) what
> the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is better
> balanced than 1650.
>
> 1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best year of
> the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail
>
>
>
> []
> Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
>
> <http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
> Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
>
> http://www.buav.org
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
> To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
> Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
>
>
>
>
> SPONSORED LINKS Computer role playing game Online role playing
> games Role playing games online
> Massive multiplayer online role playing games Star wars
> role playing game Wheel of time role playing game
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
> a.. Visit your group "mepbmlist" on the web.
>
> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
<http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
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If you are making the same moves someone else has made a 100 times before then they make the same counter moves and that means each game is the same. I have played NG about 10 times now. I have yet to play the same game twice.
A note: as for power games I have yet to play this or any of the variations of either game. Though they sound interesting, I am always in the middle of something else.
----- Original Message -----
From: morcurufin
To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, February 19, 2006 8:30 PM
Subject: [mepbmlist] Re: 2950 Power game..??!!!
There are battles in 2950 starting on T2 (turn 1 for the armies to
move). They are not on the scale of 1650. I think 2950 is more
complex game due to the smaller armies/economies. Character actions
are more important. 1650 is full of making the same moves that
someone else has made hundred of times before. 2950 is flexible and
allows any nation to prosper.
I think persons that likes turn-based strategy games, like Civ, MOO2
will like 2950. I think persons like instant gratification of first
person shooters or MMORPG's will like 1650.
2950 is empire building with smaller armies and more importance of
character actions.
1650 is more of a race of moving armies on to known pop centers and
taking them away from the other side.
I don't mean to insult anyone but to say 2950 is boring is off the
mark, I would have to say they do not understand the planning that
goes into 2950 and the subtlety of the game nuances.
Everyone in 1650 starts with a big club. In 2950 you start with
small club the good players turn it into a big club.
No offense towards anyone
James
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "Laurence G. Tilley"
<lgtilley@...> wrote:
>
> How many 2950 games have you played Serra? I ask because you
sound
> like someone who's not yet been in a good one where there's plenty
of
> "smash" right from the start. If "tends to stagnate" is your own
> experience from a fair number of games then I will have to merely
beg
> to differ with you. If you're speaking from a small number of
games,
> and hearsay, as I suspect you may be, then I'd urge you to test it
a
> bit more. There are 2950 players now who will very quickly give
you
> the military smashing you desire if you just sit back and try to
> character build.
>
> At 12:23 18/02/2006, you wrote:
> >I am not so sure I agree, with any of you. I think the real
reason
> >2950 does not do well is because it tends to stagnate. Basically,
> >people get so caught up in building up their characters and
nations
> >that they forget to fight. I personally pay to play this game to
mix
> >it up and I do not want to pay to build up my nation for 20 or so
> >odd turns. Plus, I think there are different styles of play and
> >most people who join this whole community are more into military
> >strategy rather than character based strategy. Not to say we
don't
> >enjoy that, but rather we prefer it to be on top of the military
> >part rather than the whole game. To be honest I think it is why
many
> >people avoid the 4th age scenario also. To much building and to
put
> >it in eloquently not enough smash. *smile*
> >
> >Serra
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Laurence G. Tilley
> > To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:21 AM
> > Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!
> >
> >
> > At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:
> > >why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is
blazing
> > >obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
> > >
> > >I dont understand.
> > >
> > >or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
> > >
> > >2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
> > >
> > >1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
> > >
> > >Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
> > >
> > >pro's con's etc etc.
> >
> > William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak launch
(in UK
> > anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided claim
that
> > it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to increase
the
> > income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
> > (possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about
defending it,
> > they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario
won't
> > get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made
up of
> > individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of
2950, then
> > we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming
community, so
> > it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how
good 2950 is.
> >
> > A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're both
chess,
> > then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more
play books
> > available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well
debated
> > strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played
2950 as
> > well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an
exclusive
> > club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less rude
people
> > and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if
2950
> > players want to keep it this way.
> >
> > Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use
the same
> > strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and
doing
> > some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed.
Since
> > its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't organise,
the
> > daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who
stuck
> > with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving end)
what
> > the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is better
> > balanced than 1650.
> >
> > 1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best
year of
> > the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail
> >
> >
> >
> > []
> > Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
> >
> > <http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
> > Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
> >
> > http://www.buav.org
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
> > To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
> > Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > SPONSORED LINKS Computer role playing game Online role
playing
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> > Massive multiplayer online role playing games Star wars
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> > of Service.
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> >------------------------------------------------------------------
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> >
> >
> >
> >Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
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> >
> >Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> []
> Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
>
> <http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
> Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
>
> http://www.buav.org
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
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I`m always hearing of new ideas and suggestions for the opening moves in 1650, and no 2 games have ever been the same. If everybody supposedly knows the opening moves then you have to come up with new ones, and new counter stategies.
Tara Silva <vanya1@comcast.net> wrote: If you are making the same moves someone else has made a 100 times before then they make the same counter moves and that means each game is the same. I have played NG about 10 times now. I have yet to play the same game twice.
A note: as for power games I have yet to play this or any of the variations of either game. Though they sound interesting, I am always in the middle of something else.
----- Original Message -----
From: morcurufin
To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, February 19, 2006 8:30 PM
Subject: [mepbmlist] Re: 2950 Power game..??!!!
There are battles in 2950 starting on T2 (turn 1 for the armies to
move). They are not on the scale of 1650. I think 2950 is more
complex game due to the smaller armies/economies. Character actions
are more important. 1650 is full of making the same moves that
someone else has made hundred of times before. 2950 is flexible and
allows any nation to prosper.
I think persons that likes turn-based strategy games, like Civ, MOO2
will like 2950. I think persons like instant gratification of first
person shooters or MMORPG's will like 1650.
2950 is empire building with smaller armies and more importance of
character actions.
1650 is more of a race of moving armies on to known pop centers and
taking them away from the other side.
I don't mean to insult anyone but to say 2950 is boring is off the
mark, I would have to say they do not understand the planning that
goes into 2950 and the subtlety of the game nuances.
Everyone in 1650 starts with a big club. In 2950 you start with
small club the good players turn it into a big club.
No offense towards anyone
James
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "Laurence G. Tilley"
<lgtilley@...> wrote:
>
> How many 2950 games have you played Serra? I ask because you
sound
> like someone who's not yet been in a good one where there's plenty
of
> "smash" right from the start. If "tends to stagnate" is your own
> experience from a fair number of games then I will have to merely
beg
> to differ with you. If you're speaking from a small number of
games,
> and hearsay, as I suspect you may be, then I'd urge you to test it
a
> bit more. There are 2950 players now who will very quickly give
you
> the military smashing you desire if you just sit back and try to
> character build.
>
> At 12:23 18/02/2006, you wrote:
> >I am not so sure I agree, with any of you. I think the real
reason
> >2950 does not do well is because it tends to stagnate. Basically,
> >people get so caught up in building up their characters and
nations
> >that they forget to fight. I personally pay to play this game to
mix
> >it up and I do not want to pay to build up my nation for 20 or so
> >odd turns. Plus, I think there are different styles of play and
> >most people who join this whole community are more into military
> >strategy rather than character based strategy. Not to say we
don't
> >enjoy that, but rather we prefer it to be on top of the military
> >part rather than the whole game. To be honest I think it is why
many
> >people avoid the 4th age scenario also. To much building and to
put
> >it in eloquently not enough smash. *smile*
> >
> >Serra
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Laurence G. Tilley
> > To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:21 AM
> > Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!
> >
> >
> > At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:
> > >why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is
blazing
> > >obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
> > >
> > >I dont understand.
> > >
> > >or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
> > >
> > >2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
> > >
> > >1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
> > >
> > >Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
> > >
> > >pro's con's etc etc.
> >
> > William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak launch
(in UK
> > anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided claim
that
> > it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to increase
the
> > income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
> > (possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about
defending it,
> > they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario
won't
> > get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made
up of
> > individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of
2950, then
> > we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming
community, so
> > it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how
good 2950 is.
> >
> > A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're both
chess,
> > then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more
play books
> > available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well
debated
> > strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played
2950 as
> > well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an
exclusive
> > club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less rude
people
> > and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if
2950
> > players want to keep it this way.
> >
> > Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use
the same
> > strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and
doing
> > some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed.
Since
> > its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't organise,
the
> > daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who
stuck
> > with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving end)
what
> > the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is better
> > balanced than 1650.
> >
> > 1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best
year of
> > the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail
> >
> >
> >
> > []
> > Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
> >
> > <http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
> > Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
> >
> > http://www.buav.org
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
> > To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
> > Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > SPONSORED LINKS Computer role playing game Online role
playing
> > games Role playing games online
> > Massive multiplayer online role playing games Star wars
> > role playing game Wheel of time role playing game
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------
------------
> > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
> >
> > a.. Visit your group "mepbmlist" on the web.
> >
> > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > mepbmlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
Terms
> > of Service.
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------
------------
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> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
> >Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
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> >
> >Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> []
> Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
>
> <http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
> Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
>
> http://www.buav.org
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
so you are saying you cant deal with random events???
william
auburnted wrote:
>why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is blazing
>obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
>We dont have 2950 in Brazil, but for what I know of the game, the
contrary of what you said that is obvious. 1650 is much lesser
random,
you know your cards and you know your enemy´s. And it´s quicker,
after
all. If one have not the patience and mind and dedication to
calculate
the results of his movements, maybe than it appears to be just a
ramdomly thowing of armies.Rener
<>s
*RLCS*Com os sinceros cumprimentos de Rener de Larte, Rhesus, Mago et
coetera
ICQ- 1576257 e-mail- renerdl@...
"Nature is not cruel, only pitilessly indifferent. This lesson is
one of the hardest for humans to learn. We cannot accept that things
might be neither good nor evil, neither cruel nor kind, but simply
callous: indifferent to all suffering, lacking all purpose."
Stagnate is the relative term here i think.
I am not trying to piss on anyone.
i am just trying to figure out why no one likes to play my preferred
method of play style. (2950)
William
I am not so sure I agree, with any of you. I think the real reason
2950 does not do well is because it tends to stagnate. Basically,
people get so caught up in building up their characters and nations
that they forget to fight. I personally pay to play this game to mix
it up and I do not want to pay to build up my nation for 20 or so
odd turns. Plus, I think there are different styles of play and
most people who join this whole community are more into military
strategy rather than character based strategy. Not to say we don't
enjoy that, but rather we prefer it to be on top of the military
part rather than the whole game. To be honest I think it is why many
people avoid the 4th age scenario also. To much building and to put
it in eloquently not enough smash. *smile*
Serra
From: Laurence G. Tilley
To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:21 AM
Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!>why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is
blazing
>obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
>
>I dont understand.
>
>or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
>
>2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
>
>1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
>
>Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
>
>pro's con's etc etc.William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak launch
(in UK
anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided claim
that
it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to increase
the
income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
(possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about defending
it,
they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario
won't
get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made up
of
individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of 2950,
then
we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming
community, so
it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how good
2950 is.
A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're both
chess,
then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more play
books
available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well
debated
strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played
2950 as
well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an
exclusive
club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less rude
people
and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if
2950
players want to keep it this way.
Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use the
same
strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and
doing
some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed.
Since
its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't organise,
the
daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who
stuck
with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving end)
what
the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is better
balanced than 1650.1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best
year of
the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail
[]
Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/<http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
Zero Option - end the use of primates in research[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.comSPONSORED LINKS Computer role playing game Online role playing
games Role playing games online
Massive multiplayer online role playing games Star wars
role playing game Wheel of time role playing game
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "Tara Silva" <vanya1@...> wrote:
----- Original Message -----
At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:-------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
a.. Visit your group "mepbmlist" on the web.
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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of Service.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
James,
I am reading all these posts in order and i agree with you 100%.
William
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "morcurufin" <morcurufin@...>
wrote:
There are battles in 2950 starting on T2 (turn 1 for the armies
to
move). They are not on the scale of 1650. I think 2950 is more
complex game due to the smaller armies/economies. Character
actions
are more important. 1650 is full of making the same moves that
someone else has made hundred of times before. 2950 is flexible
and
allows any nation to prosper.
I think persons that likes turn-based strategy games, like Civ,
MOO2
will like 2950. I think persons like instant gratification of
first
person shooters or MMORPG's will like 1650.
2950 is empire building with smaller armies and more importance of
character actions.1650 is more of a race of moving armies on to known pop centers
and
taking them away from the other side.
I don't mean to insult anyone but to say 2950 is boring is off the
mark, I would have to say they do not understand the planning that
goes into 2950 and the subtlety of the game nuances.Everyone in 1650 starts with a big club. In 2950 you start with
small club the good players turn it into a big club.No offense towards anyone
James
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "Laurence G. Tilley"
<lgtilley@> wrote:
>
> How many 2950 games have you played Serra? I ask because you
sound
> like someone who's not yet been in a good one where there's
plenty
of
> "smash" right from the start. If "tends to stagnate" is your
own
> experience from a fair number of games then I will have to
merely
beg
> to differ with you. If you're speaking from a small number of
games,
> and hearsay, as I suspect you may be, then I'd urge you to test
it
a
> bit more. There are 2950 players now who will very quickly give
you
> the military smashing you desire if you just sit back and try to
> character build.
>
> >I am not so sure I agree, with any of you. I think the real
reason
> >2950 does not do well is because it tends to stagnate.
Basically,
> >people get so caught up in building up their characters and
nations
> >that they forget to fight. I personally pay to play this game
to
mix
> >it up and I do not want to pay to build up my nation for 20 or
so
> >odd turns. Plus, I think there are different styles of play
and
> >most people who join this whole community are more into
military
> >strategy rather than character based strategy. Not to say we
don't
> >enjoy that, but rather we prefer it to be on top of the
military
> >part rather than the whole game. To be honest I think it is why
many
> >people avoid the 4th age scenario also. To much building and to
put
> >it in eloquently not enough smash. *smile*
> >
> >Serra
> > From: Laurence G. Tilley
> > To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:21 AM
> > Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!
> >
> >
> > >why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is
blazing
> > >obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
> > >
> > >I dont understand.
> > >
> > >or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
> > >
> > >2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
> > >
> > >1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
> > >
> > >Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
> > >
> > >pro's con's etc etc.
> >
> > William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak
launch
(in UK
> > anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided
claim
that
> > it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to
increase
the
> > income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
> > (possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about
defending it,
> > they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario
won't
> > get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made
up of
> > individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of
2950, then
> > we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming
community, so
> > it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how
good 2950 is.
> >
> > A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're
both
chess,
> > then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more
play books
> > available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well
debated
> > strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played
2950 as
> > well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an
exclusive
> > club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less
rude
people
> > and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if
2950
> > players want to keep it this way.
> >
> > Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use
the same
> > strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and
doing
> > some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed.
Since
> > its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't
organise,
the
> > daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who
stuck
> > with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving
end)
what
> > the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is
better
> > balanced than 1650.
> >
> > 1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best
year of
> > the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail
> >
> >
> >
> > []
> > Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
> >
> > <http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
> > Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
> >
> > http://www.buav.org
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
> > To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
> > Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > SPONSORED LINKS Computer role playing game Online role
playing
> > games Role playing games online
> > Massive multiplayer online role playing games Star
wars
> At 12:23 18/02/2006, you wrote:
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:
> > role playing game Wheel of time role playing game
> >
> >
> >----------------------------------------------------------------
--
------------
> > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
> >
> > a.. Visit your group "mepbmlist" on the web.
> >
> > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > mepbmlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
Terms
> > of Service.
> >
> >
> >----------------------------------------------------------------
--
------------
> >
> >
> >
> >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
> >To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
> >Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
> >
> >Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> []
> Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
>
> <http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
> Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
>
> http://www.buav.org
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Not sure if my opinion counts. I've played all 3 scenarios a lot now. This is only my opinion and I 100% understand (and support) that players want to play different formats.
IMO: 1650 is more variable due to the larger set of resources. I've not played any game of 1650 that has started off the same nor developed the same. 2950 has more "standard" moves. Played competitive chess in my time and I'd say that there are more "openings" in 1650 than in 2950.
The larger economies also give a stronger base-line to your recruitment, character naming and development and gives you a slight lee-way should things go awry which lends to a more open style of play - ie variability. I found the slow development of 2950 to be somewhat less interesting than in 1650. As I'm generally more of an army player than a character/economic developer then clearly 1650 is going to appeal to me more, but even saying that I still find the character elements of 1650 more interesting than in 2950.
I personally am biggest fan of the Grudge format - love it. Full on strategising from before turn 1. Got around another 4 ideas I'd like to try in 1650 and I'm sure that playing more will bring up some concepts to try out.... As an aside (but pertinent) my win rate at 2950 is higher than 1650 if that means anything - hence I find 1650 more challenging.
At the end of the day it's just a matter of taste - no game is particularly better than others just that there's different strokes for different folks.
Clint (player only here).
Stagnate is the relative term here i think.
I am not trying to piss on anyone.
i am just trying to figure out why no one likes to play my preferred
method of play style. (2950)William
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "Tara Silva" <vanya1@...> wrote:
>
> I am not so sure I agree, with any of you. I think the real reason
2950 does not do well is because it tends to stagnate. Basically,
people get so caught up in building up their characters and nations
that they forget to fight. I personally pay to play this game to mix
it up and I do not want to pay to build up my nation for 20 or so
odd turns. Plus, I think there are different styles of play and
most people who join this whole community are more into military
strategy rather than character based strategy. Not to say we don't
enjoy that, but rather we prefer it to be on top of the military
part rather than the whole game. To be honest I think it is why many
people avoid the 4th age scenario also. To much building and to put
it in eloquently not enough smash. *smile*
>
> Serra
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Laurence G. Tilley
> To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:21 AM
> Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!
>
> At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:
> >why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is
blazing
> >obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
> >
> >I dont understand.
> >
> >or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
> >
> >2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
> >
> >1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
> >
> >Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
> >
> >pro's con's etc etc.
>
> William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak launch
(in UK
> anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided claim
that
> it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to increase
the
> income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
> (possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about defending
it,
> they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario
won't
> get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made up
of
> individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of 2950,
then
> we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming
community, so
> it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how good
2950 is.
>
> A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're both
chess,
> then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more play
books
> available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well
debated
> strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played
2950 as
> well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an
exclusive
> club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less rude
people
> and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if
2950
> players want to keep it this way.
>
> Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use the
same
> strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and
doing
> some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed.
Since
> its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't organise,
the
> daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who
stuck
> with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving end)
what
> the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is better
> balanced than 1650.
>
> 1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best
year of
> the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail
>
> []
> Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
>
> <http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
> Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
>
> http://www.buav.org
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
> To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
> Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
>
> SPONSORED LINKS Computer role playing game Online role playing
games Role playing games online
> Massive multiplayer online role playing games Star wars
role playing game Wheel of time role playing game
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
> YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
> a.. Visit your group "mepbmlist" on the web.
>
> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> mepbmlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms
of Service.
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.comYahoo! Groups Links
--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.15.11/264 - Release Date: 17/02/06
****************************************************************
ME Games Ltd
me@middleearthgames.com
www.middleearthgames.com
UK: 340 North Road, Cardiff CF14 3BP
Tel 029 2091 3359 12-6.30 Weekdays
Fax 029 2062 5532 24 hours
US: 73 Edgewood Terrace, South Bound Brook, NJ 08880
Tel (732) 642 8777 EST
Fax 503 296 2325 (comes straight to us)
****************************************************************
Clint,
wow. i am the other way around.
i think 2950 is for the big boys.
oh well. color me purple and call me a san francisco native.
William
Not sure if my opinion counts. I've played all 3 scenarios a lot
now. This is only my opinion and I 100% understand (and support)
that
players want to play different formats.
IMO: 1650 is more variable due to the larger set of resources.
I've not
played any game of 1650 that has started off the same nor
developed the
same. 2950 has more "standard" moves. Played competitive chess
in my time
and I'd say that there are more "openings" in 1650 than in 2950.
The larger economies also give a stronger base-line to your
recruitment,
character naming and development and gives you a slight lee-way
should
things go awry which lends to a more open style of play - ie
variability. I found the slow development of 2950 to be somewhat
less
interesting than in 1650. As I'm generally more of an army player
than a
character/economic developer then clearly 1650 is going to appeal
to me
more, but even saying that I still find the character elements of
1650 more
interesting than in 2950.
I personally am biggest fan of the Grudge format - love it. Full
on
strategising from before turn 1. Got around another 4 ideas I'd
like to
try in 1650 and I'm sure that playing more will bring up some
concepts to
try out....
is higher
than 1650 if that means anything - hence I find 1650 more
challenging.
At the end of the day it's just a matter of taste - no game is
particularly
better than others just that there's different strokes for
different folks.
Clint (player only here).
>Stagnate is the relative term here i think.
>
>I am not trying to piss on anyone.
>
>i am just trying to figure out why no one likes to play my
preferred
>method of play style. (2950)
>
>William
>
>
>
> >
> > I am not so sure I agree, with any of you. I think the real
reason
>2950 does not do well is because it tends to stagnate. Basically,
>people get so caught up in building up their characters and
nations
>that they forget to fight. I personally pay to play this game to
mix
>it up and I do not want to pay to build up my nation for 20 or so
>odd turns. Plus, I think there are different styles of play and
>most people who join this whole community are more into military
>strategy rather than character based strategy. Not to say we don't
>enjoy that, but rather we prefer it to be on top of the military
>part rather than the whole game. To be honest I think it is why
many
>people avoid the 4th age scenario also. To much building and to
put
>it in eloquently not enough smash. *smile*
> >
> > Serra
> > From: Laurence G. Tilley
> > To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 5:21 AM
> > Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] 2950 Power game..??!!!
> >
> >
> > >why does most of the MEPBM players go for 1650 when it is
>blazing
> > >obvious that it is checkers, when 2950 is chess??
> > >
> > >I dont understand.
> > >
> > >or maybe i do understand, and cant believe its true?
> > >
> > >2950 is way superior to 1650, at least for the Brain pan.
> > >
> > >1650 is just throw armies at each other blah blah blah.
> > >
> > >Really and truly someone convince me i should play 1650.
> > >
> > >pro's con's etc etc.
> >
> > William, 2950 has never really recovered from its weak launch
>(in UK
> > anyway), no sooner had we heard of it than the misguided
claim
>that
> > it was "1650 with an extra ten turns on the front to increase
>the
> > income of the greedy companies" was circulating, and the GMs
> > (possibly pre Harelquin days) were so laid back about
defending
>it,
> > they were horizontal. Without positive promotion a scenario
>won't
> > get many takers. The companies however, are after all, made
up
>of
> > individuals, and if they've personally not thought much of
2950,
>then
> > we can't blame them for weak promotion. It's a gaming
>community, so
> > it falls to the like of you and I to try to tell people how
good
>2950 is.
> >
> > A bit harsh perhaps to say 1650 is chequers. If they're both
>chess,
> > then part of the popularity of 1650 is that there are more
play
>books
> > available - many more tried and trusted openings, and well
>debated
> > strategies in circulation. Those of us who've always played
>2950 as
> > well, know a trick or two though. In some ways, 2950 is an
>exclusive
> > club, less droppers, less newbies, less VP players, less rude
>people
> > and less nutters (well slightly). Perhaps understandable if
>2950
> > players want to keep it this way.
> >
> > Many people tried 2950 for the first time, and tried to use
the
>same
> > strategies as 1650, without actually looking at the map, and
>doing
> > some planning. Surprise, surprise those strategies failed.
>Since
> > its the FP in both scenarios, who lose if they don't
organise,
>the
> > daft claim went out that 2950 is DS biased. Those of us who
>stuck
> > with it though soon worked out (or saw from the receiving
end)
>what
> > the FP can do, and I remain of the opinion that 2950 is
better
> > balanced than 1650.
> >
> > 1650 is the wine, 2950 is the vintage wine, WotR is the best
>year of
> > the vintage. (4th age is the novelty cocktail
> >
> >
> >
> > []
> > Laurence G.Tilley http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/
> >
> > <http://www.buav.org/campaigns/primates/index.html>
> > Zero Option - end the use of primates in research
> >
> > http://www.buav.org
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
> > To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
> > Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > SPONSORED LINKS Computer role playing game Online role
playing
>games Role playing games online
> > Massive multiplayer online role playing games Star
wars
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, ME Games Ltd <me@...> wrote:
>--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "Tara Silva" <vanya1@> wrote:
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > At 04:50 18/02/2006, auburnted wrote:
>role playing game Wheel of time role playing game
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------
----
>-----------
> > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
> >
> > a.. Visit your group "mepbmlist" on the web.
> >
> > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > mepbmlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
Terms
>of Service.
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------
----
>-----------
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
>To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
>Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>--
>No virus found in this incoming message.
>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.15.11/264 - Release Date:
17/02/06
****************************************************************
ME Games Ltd
me@...
www.middleearthgames.comUK: 340 North Road, Cardiff CF14 3BP
Tel 029 2091 3359 12-6.30 Weekdays
Fax 029 2062 5532 24 hoursUS: 73 Edgewood Terrace, South Bound Brook, NJ 08880
Tel (732) 642 8777 EST
Fax 503 296 2325 (comes straight to us)
****************************************************************
When I started playing MEPBM a few years ago, I picked 2950 scenario
because of its timeline connection to the LOTR books.
Unfortunately, I have only played 2950 scenario, but I am hooked...
so my opinion is a bit one-sided.
I hope all would agree that MEPBM has elements of chess, checkers,
risk, and monolopy. Whether 1650 or 2950, MEPBM is a fun game.
I find 2950 rewarding due to the nation build up and economic focus
in the begining. Given the fragile economies, I suspect the season
(e.g., winter) has a greater impact in 2950 than 1650 (please let me
know if I presume too much). I have started DS nations in the
Fall / Winter, only to count the days to Spring.
Yes - there are some "canned" opening moves (military and
characters) for some nations - i.e., Osgilath. Though I believe the
outcome of these moves can be influenced by a starting spell or
character bonus.
I would argue, that a number of seasoned (I consider myself a
novice) 2950 players like to mix it up a bit. As such, I do not
believe there is a true formula (other than team work) for success
in 2950.
For those of you who tried 2950 and did not like it, I say give it
another try. You may find that the game has changed...
Chris Montgomery
Clint,
wow. i am the other way around.
i think 2950 is for the big boys.
oh well. color me purple and call me a san francisco native.
William
>
> Not sure if my opinion counts. I've played all 3 scenarios a
lot
> now. This is only my opinion and I 100% understand (and
support)
that
> players want to play different formats.
>
> IMO: 1650 is more variable due to the larger set of resources.
I've not
> played any game of 1650 that has started off the same nor
developed the
> same. 2950 has more "standard" moves. Played competitive chess
in my time
> and I'd say that there are more "openings" in 1650 than in 2950.
>
> The larger economies also give a stronger base-line to your
recruitment,
> character naming and development and gives you a slight lee-way
should
> things go awry which lends to a more open style of play - ie
> variability. I found the slow development of 2950 to be
somewhat
less
> interesting than in 1650. As I'm generally more of an army
player
than a
> character/economic developer then clearly 1650 is going to
appeal
to me
> more, but even saying that I still find the character elements
of
1650 more
> interesting than in 2950.
>
> I personally am biggest fan of the Grudge format - love it.
Full
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, "auburnted" <auburnted@...> wrote:
--- In mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com, ME Games Ltd <me@> wrote:
on
> strategising from before turn 1. Got around another 4 ideas I'd
like to
> try in 1650 and I'm sure that playing more will bring up some
concepts to
> try out....
is higher
> than 1650 if that means anything - hence I find 1650 more
challenging.
>
> At the end of the day it's just a matter of taste - no game is
particularly
> better than others just that there's different strokes for
different folks.
>
> Clint (player only here).
>
>
> >Stagnate is the relative term here i think.
> >
> >I am not trying to piss on anyone.
> >
> >i am just trying to figure out why no one likes to play my
preferred
> >method of play style. (2950)
> >
> >William