2nd Edition of 1650 mepbm

I think you should really step back and think about the type of
game you end up with if you want to start going for realism.

I agree completely with Alan. IMHO, realism effects are beneficial only if they do not add significantly to the degree of difficulty of the game for the AVERAGE player. I would include in this category both small fixes on order limitations (i.e. why can't a SG mage join a NG army if they are Friendly to one another? Are the soldiers so nationalistic they won't let the guy with the fireballs hang out with them? Why can't most of the orders (PrenMgy, InfYour, RschSP) that can be done in your pop centers not be done in a Friendly nations centers) and minor additions to character orders, such as adding spells or a map movement order.

I would not be a supporter of adding time delays to caravans. I do not think the average player really wants to have to project out his finances for 3 turns, especially given the HUGE effects that enemy action and just random chance will play on his finances. Also, caravan delays will be no problem for most of the tightly packed DS, and far more problematical for the widely scattered free. It is ESPECIALLY painful for that joke of the free team, the woodmen, who get to start the game with a turn 1 message to their allies saying "I know we just started but given the possability that the DrLd may attack one of my pop centers on turn 4 I need you to send me money right now so it will be here when I need it." I have seen even good players collapse due to a gold miscalculation, without hostile enemy action, and I think preventing teammates from assisting poor allies with a 1 turn delay will lead to unpleasant situations like "Well guys, I'm economically dead in 2 turns, and none of us can do anything about it, cause the check can't reach in time." That doesn't sound like a very fun way to go out to me.

National troop bonuses I would place somewhere in the middle, as long as they were clearly published. A given player only needs to keep track of his own bonuses, and those of nearby enemies. This IMHO would be a small price to pay to actually see different troop types.

A related suggestion to giving nations bonuses for preferred troops might be to alter certain upkeep costs by nation, so that if (for example) the woodmen had LI that cost 1 gold per turn, it would be a much more realistic decision between maximum recruitment strength (HI or HC) and cost/combat value ratio. Other nations might have cheaper archers or LC. This might reflect cheaper training costs for nations with certain national skills in common, or cheaper upkeep on equipment (it costs less to supply the elven archers because they have their own bows and make their own arrows, etc...).

Winn

···

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These are points I agree with except maybe the caravans. Most goods
can be within 1 turn of each other but the Dragon Lord would be key to
keeping the Witch King alive. This would entail better play.

--- In mepbmlist@y..., "Winn Keathley" <Gnaeus@h...> wrote:

>I think you should really step back and think about the type of
>game you end up with if you want to start going for realism.

I agree completely with Alan. IMHO, realism effects are beneficial

only if

they do not add significantly to the degree of difficulty of the

game for

the AVERAGE player. I would include in this category both small

fixes on

order limitations (i.e. why can't a SG mage join a NG army if they are
Friendly to one another? Are the soldiers so nationalistic they

won't let

the guy with the fireballs hang out with them? Why can't most of the

orders

(PrenMgy, InfYour, RschSP) that can be done in your pop centers not

be done

in a Friendly nations centers) and minor additions to character

orders, such

as adding spells or a map movement order.

I would not be a supporter of adding time delays to caravans. I do

not think

the average player really wants to have to project out his finances

for 3

turns, especially given the HUGE effects that enemy action and just

random

chance will play on his finances. Also, caravan delays will be no

problem

for most of the tightly packed DS, and far more problematical for

the widely

scattered free. It is ESPECIALLY painful for that joke of the free

team, the

woodmen, who get to start the game with a turn 1 message to their

allies

saying "I know we just started but given the possability that the

DrLd may

attack one of my pop centers on turn 4 I need you to send me money

right now

so it will be here when I need it." I have seen even good players

collapse

due to a gold miscalculation, without hostile enemy action, and I think
preventing teammates from assisting poor allies with a 1 turn delay

will

lead to unpleasant situations like "Well guys, I'm economically dead

in 2

turns, and none of us can do anything about it, cause the check

can't reach

in time." That doesn't sound like a very fun way to go out to me.

National troop bonuses I would place somewhere in the middle, as

long as

they were clearly published. A given player only needs to keep track

of his

own bonuses, and those of nearby enemies. This IMHO would be a small

price

to pay to actually see different troop types.

A related suggestion to giving nations bonuses for preferred troops

might be

to alter certain upkeep costs by nation, so that if (for example) the
woodmen had LI that cost 1 gold per turn, it would be a much more

realistic

decision between maximum recruitment strength (HI or HC) and

cost/combat

value ratio. Other nations might have cheaper archers or LC. This might
reflect cheaper training costs for nations with certain national

skills in

common, or cheaper upkeep on equipment (it costs less to supply the

elven

archers because they have their own bows and make their own arrows,

etc...).

···

Winn
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com