Degrading camps

At what point in the sequence does a camp degrade from low loyalty? I am trying to figure out two things: Can you you count on gold produced from a camp with less than 15 loyalty and can you count on selling anything produced at such a camp. Thanks in advance.

Christian

hi

If you got a char in your camp it wont degrade (if you want to sell there is a char), furthermore my impression is that the camp will degrade at the end or start of the turn, given no loyalty drops by enemy armies or loosing your capitol.

Loke

mr smith( of the witch king smith some time ago?),
nice to read you again, hope all is well.

sm

I am the self-same Smith of what seems like the not-so-long-ago g57 (perhaps because so few games have elapsed between then and now for me). Since it seems but a short time ago i remeber well nearly al the details of my game 57 debut including some fond memories of my tutelage under sm#20. I actually quit MEPBM till this summer when Jason Roberts dragged me back in. Well met Mr. Muller. Wish we were meeting as allies or foes.

Smith

I looked at some old pdfs and concluded that pop centers degrade somewhere between 300 and 310 in the sequence. So you can’t count on natselling anything produced at camps that might have 15 or less loyalty prior to 301 in the sequence (assuming no character/fortification present). Don’t yet know if revenue is collected prior to pop center degredation (eg can you collect income from a village on the same turn it degrades?). Also don’t yet know if gold production at pop centers is collected prior to degredation (eg does a camp w/ gold production give you any gold on the ame turn it dgreades?).

Christian