Oh, and Drew…
pray tell you’re not going to make us Northwest guys play 68 out to the very bitter end in a “whack-a-CL” scenario… Presuming Brad doesn’t do something about you before we get through him to you… <grin>
Dave, you’re getting to be almost as tiresome as Brad on this board (note I said almost <g>). And as you very well know, game 68 has one of those end game triggers people like you crave.
Hey, your comment above makes my point exactly. The DS in the game this thread is about should have disposed of TOR themselves to end the game, not whine and cry about their opposition not dropping.
No it’s not awful; my team voted to accept the 2:1 and that’s fine with me. My point was that dshimel said the 2:1 would be a requirement for all future games his team started, but it was an afterthought apparently for game 239. No big deal really, either way. Grudge games seem to have a tendency for the team that carves out the initial small advantage to leverage that into a larger and larger advantage as the game progresses. Even without an agreed-to beforehand 2:1 automatic victory, I personally would have no desire to hold out for a One Ring victory against a grudge team.
It was mentioned in one of the early emails, but slipped through the cracks in the delay between accepting LGTs offer and getting the team firmed up.
238 was a grudge game, and we didn’t carve out an initial small advantage then leverege it.
In the first 10 turns we cleared Rhun and the Iron Hills. We were pounding Mirkwood and they were forced to hide the Silvan capital to keep us from capturing it. We’d sunk the SG navy. We’d taken many Gondor pops and were forcing them to throw Rider, Wizard and Dun armies into Gondor to keep us from clearing the place out. The game was truely over in 10 turns…
From there it just got ugly. 5 more turns to take out the Woodmen and Sindar. 5 more turns to finish off the Gap of Rohan and the rest of the Gondors. 6 more turns to get troops into the extreme Northwest to finish off the Rangers, Noldor and Dwarves. 2 more turns to take back the last MT they emi’d from us as the last of their capitals fell.
There was no small advantage that got leveraged into a big advantage. It was a blowout from word go. 28 turn game, 18 of which ran after it was “over”.
Well there goes the entire plot of LOTR, I suppose.
Right. Real men stand up and fight. That is what the Chateau Generals of WWI thought as did the Zulu Impi commanders as they charged the gatling guns. I saw persons like that in the Army and they got a lot of guys killed.
Part of why I admire Stassun/Feilds is that their simulation was flexible enough to accomodate many approaches. Some levels are invisible to some players, while others are considered unfair. I’m afraid the unimaginative are in the driver’s seat.
this thread has somewhat developed into a discussion pro & contra ring victory and bug hunts. let me state that though I think ring victory is viable, I am NOT promoting bug hunts in any way. again, our obstinacy mainly resulted from the disrespect our opponents were expressing. it has been said that if the DS were as dominant as some of them claimed, they should have prevented us from getting the ring at all. that holds some truth. I do not argue they were superior, but I have lost and won other games more clearly. as for the general idea of ring victory, I think it is a wise addition to the game, meant to prevent players from thinking one-dimensional, and from feeling safe. feeling safe is the beginning of boredom. there have been not too many occasions on which a losing side pulled off a ring victory, but just enough for any player/team to be a little afraid of the possibility, and that adds some spice to the game which I appreciate. whoever does not like the idea of ring victory is free to play the fourth age scenario.
finally, experiences I have made in other games recently lead me to this conclusion: the VAST majority of the games that are spoiled, is spoiled by people dropping, NOT by people playing on. think about that.
Damn, I thought this thread was about to fade away into the back pages. That was my hope anyway.
Wow - I am almost speechless. Was a little bored and decided to check out the ME- PBM forums to find this post. I played the Dragon Lord in this game, and was one of the people who did not approve of ‘our’ harsh messages. Now I can honestly say I am embarassed by some of my teammates comments, and am glad I decided not to continue on in the grudge team. FP, I totally see where you are coming from, and myself would have continued on had I been in your shoes - I would only respectfully have dropped out had I been treated with respect. Hell, I initially thought some of my teammates were taunting you in hopes of continuing the game, as common sense would indicate name calling would only anger you and strenghten your resolve to continue and hopefully make us eat our words. Whether we were better players (as in game strategy) or not has nothing to do with the insulting comments coming from some of the people I teamed with, and I have never seen a clearer example of poor winners. Reminds me of a little league tournament I watched where one side had a clear advantage over their opposition. The winning team shouted insults of “You suck,” “Just give up now,” “Losers,” to the other team. It was quite unecessary and very poor sportmanship. I am sorry some of my teammates acted in the same manner. It truly ruined the game for me midway through it, and was the reason I did not return for another (not from boredom as someone might want to suggest - please don’t speak for the whole team anymore). And yes we did sweat a little at the end and thought there was a slight possibility for the one ring victory - in fact, had it not been for Khamul’s lucky steal you would have pulled it off as all our assasinate plans failed. Good luck in your games and maybe after a small break I will want to play again in a game without all the unnecessary drama. As it stands - I truly feel there were no winners in this game…
Shawn Glass
still the dead horse is beaten. the game is so far over, let it rest.
But Muller the game may be over but that does not mean the game has ended. Actions have consequences as well you know and you should know that all to well. You insulted me lost the challange but did you let it rest?
No having taken that beating you still had the poor sportsmanship not to take your beating but still insult me.
So I dont think you have the moral ground to offer any advice.
Or as you say, you where beaten give it a rest, take your own advice.
Always here to remind you!
I told you I would be and you should know by now I wont let you forget.
Is that called taunting or as the victor do the spoils go to me?
Vandal
like a dog with his nose to my hindquarters, follow me as you wish.(thats swordfish you smell, dinner last night). i just had coffee. wait an hour, you can have some served at 98.6 degrees.
sm
Tut tut tut do you neer learn that your misguided insults just dont work.
You insult a better player who just happened to prove the point on one on one on the field of battle.
So your reduced to giving your wisdom to possible better players, who just dont perhaps realise how poor you are.
I dont follow you but sit on your shoulders just to remind you of the sad fact your a loser, you faced me and you lost.
Oh and if your threateneing me with some kind of personal attack with hot coffee as I always say you know where I am and if youi want to try, well be my guest.
But perhaps it sums up how poor a player you are that you find the need to drop to such a level.
Muller you lost and never had the good grace to go gentle into that night, I told you then the consequences and you want to play with me well we have many a year.
So bring on your foolish insults I do so enjoy a slugfest, especially to those who lose to me, its hard to slag of my play when you have had your butt whipped by me.
You whelched on the bet, you dropped out on turn what? over by turn 6? I think its time to put you down again.
No as I said at the time who is the master and who is the servant and to the victor goes the spoils.
Want to tell me how great you played or how you beat me up or some other fairy tale?
No I think not lets see what other insults you can think of as its the best you can do.
Oh I do so love it as you wriggle like a worm on my hook, please carry on I enjoy it so.
Over to you…
Vandal
why are you here?
- theres a whole thread on your “victory”, what welch?
- your another tough guy across the pond/computer screen.
- while my use of english slang is limited, you a twat, prat and wanker all in one. nicely done.
- last nights meal was steak and spuds, enjoy sniffing around my end.
- i’m done here, find me elsewhere.
sm
sorry brad
Wriggle little worm and dance to my tune for I do so love to see you degrade yourself.
I much suspect you are double jointed and wonder where indeed that mouth has been.
Never agree to soemthing in a e mail and then renage on it, it has this habit of coming back to haunt you, since e mails have a habit of being kept. As to what it is i dont need to repaet it I have told you enough times already, even before your poor play was exposed.
Oh yes I know you are done, I did you and you know what, there is very little you can do about it. You played you lost and now you have to suffer that we played to see who weas better and sadly it was not you and I bet you cannot handle it. beaten by me, now thats to much to bear I am sure.
Tough? perhaps not but against you, well do I neEd to be?
Vandal
If the shoe fits… It isn’t our fault that you suck so badly that by turn 10 the game was over. It isn’t our fault that you suck so badly that the game was totally unchallenging. It isn’t our fault that you suck so badly that you really had no clue just how badly you suck or how badly you were destroyed in the first 10 turns.
We weren’t disrespectful until you got all upity about us asking how much longer… In short, it is your own cluelessness, that lead to an honest question (How much longer?) being misinterprited as disrespect.
If you had any kind of clue about this game, you would have realized that it was over on GT10. Were you not so utterly incompitent, when we asked “How much longer?”, you would have seen it as a fair question instead of disrespect.
You’re a freakin LIAR!!! We’re playing WotR, with super beefed up FP pop base, and we took EVERY one of your major towns and cities (22 at game start) in only 28 turns. Add in another 30 or so towns you started with, all but 1 or 2 of which we took.
There is NO WAY you have ever been in a game so clearly dominated by one side. Well, maybe you’ve lost worse than that… But there is no way you’ve won more clearly than that.
The ring was a side show and you never had a chance!!!
Think about this… We rolled over your team as if you weren’t even running turns… You suck and you should have dropped by GT15… GT20 at the absolute latest.
Respect isn’t granted… It is earned. Your team has received far more respect than it has earned. Calling you utterly imcompitant is FAR more respect than you deserve.
And your actions… Continueing to play in a game you had 0% chance of winning proves what a sucky player you are. Losing so badly, so quickly, shows what a sucky player you are.
The things I’ve said on this board reflect only a small amount of the utter disrespect I have for you. To let yourself get flogged so badly, for so long… Wasting so much of your oppositions money and time…
I may have proven that I have no respect for you, but you have proven you deserve no respect in the first place.
You suck at this game. You suck as a player of this game. You suck so badly you can’t even begin to see just how badly you suck.
This is a game, and we should all play in a way to try to make this a fun game. Being a bug, refusing to drop when you’re utterly outmatched… Forcing the opposition to waste months and hundreds of dollars in an unchallenging game… That is not fun, and should be discouraged in the strongest of terms.
Pray tell who are you ranting at? in this last message.
Now as I myself played for one whole year against one player who wanted to make us knock him out to the last pop centre and whilst I found this frustrating never said a word about it, sometimes is there the need to go so overboard.
Its poor but within the rules, just mark them off as not to play again and save the stroke.
I think most players have got the idea just how bad you whipped them.
Vandal
I think most players have got the idea just what a pathetic sociopath mr shimel is.
Darrell,
Enough already. The game is over, you won. Those points are undisputed. It is obvious that they fought on simply to spite you and those on your team because of the…disrespectful comments and gloating postings you posted. Your behavior actually lengthened the game thus bringing on what you wanted to avoid.
They had a right to fight it out to the last man if they wish. When you rouse the will to resist to that point you have no one to blame but yourself. They were not under any obligation to quit early just to save YOU some money; don’t forget that they paid the exact same amount for each turn as you did, with probably far less enjoyment because if they were being beaten so badly they had to know that just as much as you did. The long slow descent into defeat is not enjoyable. They fought on simply to spite you and yours, and as has been pointed out you caused it to happen. Let this thread die. You have lost the argument, they had the ability or at least the chance of the One Ring option until the very end would that have been a win, by the rules yes it would have been. Even members of your own team have written in this thread that the One Ring option did indeed come close to success with many of your assassination attempts failing so this was a viable option. Your taking their towns made this the only chance and as long as they had the towns to keep you busy they made their attemp. I have seen very few posts on this thread that you yourself started supporting your position that they were obligated to surrender just because you felt the game was lost.
Darrell I don’t seek a flame war with you or anyone else, I write to you out of a desire to stop such an inflamatory thread. This is a public forum, people who are thinking about joining a game for the first time may come here to read about the experiences people were having, in order to decide whether they want to become involved. Reading the Vitriole that you have gushed forth is counter to getting the player base larger or to recruiting new players. Who would want to subject themselves to that? Let it end. You won, congratulations. Let this end, the longer you let this go the more respect you lose. Before you respond to the last sentence that you don’t care what people think I want to point out that if that was the case you would not be argueing your superiority so vehemently. I had no dog in this fight, but I do think that you have taken it farther than you should have. No one is going to agree that you are better than them and if that is what you are seeking you are wasting your time and damaging the games image by continued postings on a game that ended weeks ago. Let it go, move on try having fun and being light hearted about your postings maybe you will enjoy the game more. I am certain that others playing in and reading about your games will
Brad