LOTR preview

The quote you gave should actually be:-

Eagles may soar, but weasels don’t get sucked into jet engines.

···

From: Din >Reply-To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com>To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com>Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] Re: LOTR preview>Date: Tue, 1 May 2001 00:33:57 +1000 (EST)>>>— Christopher wrote: > I>think I speak for several people in USA or North> > America - please> > not again ;-)> >> > How was the preview?>>I think they were too busy working out how tall>gandalf was to notice.>>:)>>thanks>din>>p.s even if it was bad, I will still pay money to>watch it. But only once.>>I’m actually interesting in movie number 2 and 3, ie>how will they remind the audience of what they saw a>year ago. And will they try to make people think they>just saw a complete movie, or will it be a ‘wait a>year, to see what happens’ sort of movie (like they do>at the end of season’s break for all a TV series).>> >> > Chris -> >> > not to be confused with Mr. Soar…>>is that like ‘eagles may soar, but turkeys don’t get>sucked into a plane’s engine ?’> >>>>_____________________________________________________________________________>http://store.yahoo.com.au - Yahoo! Store>- It’s time you had your business online!


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The quote you gave should actually be

'Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into
jet engines'

My fault. Your ending "don't get sucked into jet
engines" is the correct ending (I had a brain loss
when I was typing, and I couldn't remember the words),
but I've heard the word turkey more times than
weasels.

The quote is meant to imply that while being great is
good (the 'eagles may soar' bit), being an idiot isn't
that bad - as being great could carry larger risks if
things go bad. And a turkey is more inclined to
represent an idiot than a weasel.

I think a weasel implies cunning or being sneaky.

thanks
din

p.s but thanks for the correct ending.

···

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- It's time you had your business online!

Anyone playing Game 19 (NKA),

There has been a coup in the neutral nation of the
Dominion and I am now the new heir. I wish to make
contact with any nation that desires to open
diplomatic channels.

Heir Apparent

···

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For the UK players:

I notice everyone talking about the new LOTR movie.

Do you know that there were 3 movies produced during the late 1970's.

There was the second part of the part cartoon called "Return of the King"

This company also did "The Hobbit"

Both are not too bad considering the time difference.

I have both if anyone is interested?

Colin

Wow - we never saw these, Stu says there was a 3rd part done in cartoon as
well. Cool. Anyone in the UK seen that? How could we get them?

Clint

For the UK players:

I notice everyone talking about the new LOTR movie.
> Do you know that there were 3 movies produced during the late 1970's.
> There was the second part of the part cartoon called "Return of the

King"

···

> This company also did "The Hobbit"
> Both are not too bad considering the time difference.
> I have both if anyone is interested?
> Colin

--- In mepbmlist@y..., "Middle Earth PBM Games" <me@M...> wrote:

Wow - we never saw these, Stu says there was a 3rd part done in
cartoon as well. Cool. Anyone in the UK seen that? How could
we get them?

Clint

At least the animated feature, "Lord of the Rings" is being released
on DVD this fall, to coincide with the launch of the first live-action
movie (I want I want I want I want to see it already!).

--- Middle Earth PBM Games <me@MiddleEarthGames.com>
wrote: > Wow - we never saw these, Stu says there was
a 3rd

part done in cartoon as
well. Cool. Anyone in the UK seen that? How could
we get them?

there is a old site (which still works) that talked
about all the movies that were made. I suggest
starting there.

I don't have the address, so you will have to look :slight_smile:

Once you have a list of what was made, you can then
try to track them down using the net.

A quicker way would be to ask a tolkien group.

thanks
din

···

Clint

> For the UK players:
>
> I notice everyone talking about the new LOTR
movie.
> > Do you know that there were 3 movies produced
during the late 1970's.
> > There was the second part of the part cartoon
called "Return of the
King"
> > This company also did "The Hobbit"
> > Both are not too bad considering the time
difference.
> > I have both if anyone is interested?
> > Colin
>

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- It's time you had your business online!

Middle Earth PBM Games wrote:

Wow - we never saw these, Stu says there was a 3rd part done in cartoon as
well. Cool. Anyone in the UK seen that? How could we get them?

Clint

Dunno about what's available in the UK, but FWIW here's what I can tell
you from this side of the pond, speaking as a 'Merkin who has seen all
three several times:

Two 'cartoon' movies [1] - 'The Hobbit' and 'Return of the King' - were
made by the team of Rankin & Bass, who are known, among other things,
for producing a number of literary interpretations in anime. Copies are
still readily available in most good video stores and online; at this
time yours truly has both on the shelf.

The third, entitiled 'Lord of the Rings' was produced by Ralph Baksche
(not sure of the spelling), sort of the Stanley Kubrick of animation,
and covers roughly the first half of the trilogy. AFAIK it is out of
print and copies are very hard to find; most video stores have a copy
for rent but rarely for sale. The most accessible source for most folks
would be EBay (no I'm not kidding).

Following are reviews by yours truly; skip to the next message if you
like...

"The Hobbit" - Rankin & Bass do a credible job of bringing the story to
the screen, which for many people was their first visual encounter with
Tolkein. The images of Gandalf and Bilbo in particular for many
Americans are 'the' way these characters are supposed to look, though in
retrospect the hobbits look more like dewey-eyed troll dolls than little
people. The production stays true to story and dialogue, but much
detail is lost in the need to compress the story to 78 minutes. Best
scenes include those with Smaug, which are much too short IMHO.
Featured voices include Orson Bean, John Huston, and Richard Boone.
2 1/2 stars out of 4 - nicely made but too short

"Lord of the Rings" - In this production Ralph Baksche makes use of one
of his famous techniques - animation traced from film of live actors.
On some occasions the effect is startling, but for the most part it's
merely distracting. Much of Tolkein's exposition is lost, making the
story exceedingly difficult to follow if you're not a Tolkein buff to
start with. Galadriel and the Balrog are rendered with credible care,
but other scenes are rather disappointing; Gandalf at Saruman's tower (a
scene referred to but not actually depicted in the book) looks like a
bad case of Parkinson's, and the Nazgul generally come off more like
hunchbacks in dark sheets than genuinely frightening. There is a
particular scene of orcs marching which consists of a bizarre montage of
animation and high-contrast live-action film in garish colors which
embodies the weakness of this film - all sound and fury in a confusing
swirl with no particular point to make.
1 star out of 4 - Just for being daring, though it fails miserably.

"Return of the King" - The second Rankin & Bass production covers
roughly the last book of the trilogy - that's right, there is a gap
between this and the previous movie, and once again no effort is made to
update those who don't already know the story. The main flaw of this
film, IMHO, is that they let the Japanese animators at the storyboards
way too often, with the introduction of some elements that just don't
work. For example, the cofrontation between Eowyn and the Witch-King is
rendered in stunning detail and very true to the original, fell beast
and all. Later, however, the Nazgul are depicted as laughing skeletons
riding black pegasi - very very different, and completely wrong. Sam's
temptation to claim the ring is grossly overdone, complete with a
five-minute musical piece wherein the whole of Mordor is transformed
into a garden paradise and the orcs into cute fuzzy animals - totally
unnecessary, distracting, and, well, a little fruity. At the end,
Gandalf expounds on how Merry and Pippin are taller then Frodo, who is
taller then Bilbo; the idea is that the hobbits are turning into
humans. Gandalf then turns to the camera and solemnly intones, "Is
there any hobbit in you? Is there?" It's enough to make Elrond puke.
Featured voices include Orson Bean, John Huston, William Conrad, Roddy
McDowell, and Glenn Yarborough [2]
0 stars - for f***ing with a good story

-ED \1/

[1] There are those who prefer the term 'animation' or 'anime' since the
word 'cartoon' implies funny stufff for kids, which some animation
decidedly is not.
[2] A well-known if not always respected 'Merkin folk singer, known for
a peculiar warble. Those who have seen the film often break into a
rendition of "Fro-o-do-o of the ni-i-i-ne fingers, and the Ri-i-ng of
Dooo-ooo-oooooommmm!!!!"

The Ralph Bakshi one? That's only the first half, as I understand it, I
don't think the other half was ever made. Everyone I know seems to hate it,
but I thought it was quite alright...

Regards,
Tim.

···

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 02:58:18PM -0000, oysteint@ifi.uio.no wrote:

At least the animated feature, "Lord of the Rings" is being released
on DVD this fall, to coincide with the launch of the first live-action
movie (I want I want I want I want to see it already!).

Tim Franklin wrote:

> At least the animated feature, "Lord of the Rings" is being released
> on DVD this fall, to coincide with the launch of the first live-action
> movie (I want I want I want I want to see it already!).

The Ralph Bakshi one? That's only the first half, as I understand it, I
don't think the other half was ever made. Everyone I know seems to hate it,
but I thought it was quite alright...

I'd give it high marks for ambition but low marks for execution. Try
watching it and imagine you don't already know the story; how easy would
it be to figure out? Also, the visuals are often a confusing melange as
opposed to impressive; remember the purpose of having a visible image at
all, art aside, is to help tell the story. If the viewer cannot tell
what the hell is going on you have done him a disservice no matter how
pretty it may look.

-ED \1/

···

On Wed, May 02, 2001 at 02:58:18PM -0000, oysteint@ifi.uio.no wrote:

I found it pretty coherent, apart from the obvious problem of finishing
without resolving anything :slight_smile: Seriously, although I'd read the book several
times before I saw it, it didn't feel at all choppy or like anything had been
missed out.

Re: visuals - I thought the overlayed / manipulated live-video orcs worked
well, emphasised the distinction not just between the good guys in bright
solid colours and these dark bad guy, but made them look really other-worldly
to the humans, hobbits et al, as befits a twisted creation of Morgoth, rather
than children of the Valar.

While we're on the topic of non-book versions, one thing I would *highly*
recommend is the BBC LOTR radio play. This is a proper radio drama, not
just someone reading the book, with real actors (Ian Holme, John Le Meseurier
and those of a similar calibre), the finest effects the BBC Radiophonic
Workshop has to offer. It's 13 hours, available on lots of cassettes or
slighltly fewer CDs. I paid about 50 quid for the tapes, and it's worth every
penny.

Regards,
Tim.

···

On Thu, May 03, 2001 at 10:14:23PM -0400, Edward A. Dimmick wrote:

> The Ralph Bakshi one? That's only the first half, as I understand it, I
> don't think the other half was ever made. Everyone I know seems to hate it,
> but I thought it was quite alright...
>
I'd give it high marks for ambition but low marks for execution. Try
watching it and imagine you don't already know the story; how easy would
it be to figure out? Also, the visuals are often a confusing melange as
opposed to impressive; remember the purpose of having a visible image at
all, art aside, is to help tell the story. If the viewer cannot tell
what the hell is going on you have done him a disservice no matter how
pretty it may look.

> > The Ralph Bakshi one? That's only the first half, as I understand it,

I

> > don't think the other half was ever made. Everyone I know seems to

hate it,

> > but I thought it was quite alright...
> >
> I'd give it high marks for ambition but low marks for execution. Try
> watching it and imagine you don't already know the story; how easy would
> it be to figure out? Also, the visuals are often a confusing melange as
> opposed to impressive; remember the purpose of having a visible image at
> all, art aside, is to help tell the story. If the viewer cannot tell
> what the hell is going on you have done him a disservice no matter how
> pretty it may look.

I found it pretty coherent, apart from the obvious problem of finishing
without resolving anything :slight_smile: Seriously, although I'd read the book

several

times before I saw it, it didn't feel at all choppy or like anything had

been

missed out.

Re: visuals - I thought the overlayed / manipulated live-video orcs worked
well, emphasised the distinction not just between the good guys in bright
solid colours and these dark bad guy, but made them look really

other-worldly

to the humans, hobbits et al, as befits a twisted creation of Morgoth,

rather

than children of the Valar.

While we're on the topic of non-book versions, one thing I would *highly*
recommend is the BBC LOTR radio play. This is a proper radio drama, not
just someone reading the book, with real actors (Ian Holme, John Le

Meseurier

and those of a similar calibre), the finest effects the BBC Radiophonic
Workshop has to offer. It's 13 hours, available on lots of cassettes or
slighltly fewer CDs. I paid about 50 quid for the tapes, and it's worth

every

penny.

Regards,
Tim.

RD: I agree with most of the above. I enjoyed the film (apart from it
ending halfway thru) but I don't know how it went down with people who
hadn't read the books.

I also agree that the BBC tapes/cds are vastly under-appreciated. The
Hobbit is available in the same formats, and for me, is even better than
LotR.

Regards,

Richard.

···

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Franklin" <tim@pelican.org>
To: <mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2001 7:42 PM
Subject: Re: [mepbmlist] Re: Older JRRT Movies

On Thu, May 03, 2001 at 10:14:23PM -0400, Edward A. Dimmick wrote:

--- In mepbmlist@y..., Tim Franklin <tim@p...> wrote:

···

On Thu, May 03, 2001 at 10:14:23PM -0400, Edward A. Dimmick wrote:

While we're on the topic of non-book versions, one thing I would
*highly* recommend is the BBC LOTR radio play. This is a proper
radio drama, not just someone reading the book, with real actors
(Ian Holme, John Le Meseurier and those of a similar calibre),
the finest effects the BBC Radiophonic Workshop has to offer.
It's 13 hours, available on lots of cassettes or slighltly fewer
CDs. I paid about 50 quid for the tapes, and it's worth every penny.

Regards,
Tim.

I have to fully agree with this. The radio play is awesome :))

And Ian Holm who plays Frodo in it, is in the LOTR movies being made
as Bilbo! And looking very good from the pictures I've seen!!

Øystein

After the Bashki version 2 child like animated movies were made. The
"Hobbit" came out followed be "The Return of the King". Both were
horrible. It was a kiddie show showing Tolkien as a kiddie tale. The
animation were Saturday morning quality at best. One had no idea who
is who. Aragon is just some guy who shows up on a ship after the
battle of the Pelennor Fields. The only scene which is like the book
is death of Theoden followed by the death of the Witch King. The
Bashki movie rocked compared to these two.
--- In mepbmlist@y..., oysteint@i... wrote:

···

--- In mepbmlist@y..., Tim Franklin <tim@p...> wrote:
> On Thu, May 03, 2001 at 10:14:23PM -0400, Edward A. Dimmick wrote:
>

> While we're on the topic of non-book versions, one thing I would
> *highly* recommend is the BBC LOTR radio play. This is a proper
> radio drama, not just someone reading the book, with real actors
> (Ian Holme, John Le Meseurier and those of a similar calibre),
> the finest effects the BBC Radiophonic Workshop has to offer.
> It's 13 hours, available on lots of cassettes or slighltly fewer
> CDs. I paid about 50 quid for the tapes, and it's worth every penny.
>
> Regards,
> Tim.

I have to fully agree with this. The radio play is awesome :))

And Ian Holm who plays Frodo in it, is in the LOTR movies being made
as Bilbo! And looking very good from the pictures I've seen!!

Øystein

Actually, and chronologically, the Hobbit was the first movie, being
released in 1977, IIRC.
Then the LOTR, then Return of the King.

···

-----Original Message-----
From: lucasc68@yahoo.com [mailto:lucasc68@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2001 7:15 PM
To: mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [mepbmlist] Re: Older JRRT Movies

After the Bashki version 2 child like animated movies were made. The
"Hobbit" came out followed be "The Return of the King". Both were
horrible. It was a kiddie show showing Tolkien as a kiddie tale. The
animation were Saturday morning quality at best. One had no idea who
is who. Aragon is just some guy who shows up on a ship after the
battle of the Pelennor Fields. The only scene which is like the book
is death of Theoden followed by the death of the Witch King. The
Bashki movie rocked compared to these two.
--- In mepbmlist@y..., oysteint@i... wrote:
> --- In mepbmlist@y..., Tim Franklin <tim@p...> wrote:
> > On Thu, May 03, 2001 at 10:14:23PM -0400, Edward A. Dimmick wrote:
> >
>
> > While we're on the topic of non-book versions, one thing I would
> > *highly* recommend is the BBC LOTR radio play. This is a proper
> > radio drama, not just someone reading the book, with real actors
> > (Ian Holme, John Le Meseurier and those of a similar calibre),
> > the finest effects the BBC Radiophonic Workshop has to offer.
> > It's 13 hours, available on lots of cassettes or slighltly fewer
> > CDs. I paid about 50 quid for the tapes, and it's worth every penny.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Tim.
>
> I have to fully agree with this. The radio play is awesome :))
>
> And Ian Holm who plays Frodo in it, is in the LOTR movies being made
> as Bilbo! And looking very good from the pictures I've seen!!
>
> �ystein

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