new alignment for grudge games

mepbmlist
#1

Hi,

Brad of the Clan Valadan wrote ...

The DS have beaten the Free 2-1 over the long term.

Yes, I know (though it's more like 60-40 than 2-1) .. my point was precisely that! The figures
show the trend over the long term - they do not reflect the changed situation brought about by
alterations in agent rules etc etc. I would contend that, certainly until considerably more time
has elapsed, any further attempts to boost the FP or reduce the powers of the DS would run a
severe danger of swinging the balance too far the other way.

Colin.

#2

Brad of the Clan Valadan wrote ...
> The DS have beaten the Free 2-1 over the long term.
Yes, I know (though it's more like 60-40 than 2-1) .. my point was precisely that! The figures
show the trend over the long term - they do not reflect the changed situation brought about by
alterations in agent rules etc etc.

Yes, and the figures also cover all games. I'm more interested in the results from team games of experienced players where all nations get played to a reasonable fulfillment of potential. Take games into the statistics where Nol Sin and SGo all dropped on turn 13 because the players ran away to join the circus, and you get a distorted picture (saw this once, they actually left college and went off to do their national service.)

So for want of reliable data, one has to use what's at hand - one's own experience, however anecdotal the conclusions may appear. I find that when I play DS I almost always win, and when I play FP I often lose. I'm usually playing with the same people, or at least people of roughly equivalent experience. When I've won as FP, I can't think of a single time that I've thought the DS have played adequately. It's a bit disappointing when you've celebrated victory then find out that the ClL had 4 agents, and 3 nations weren't talking to the others at all.

I'd be interested to know if this "feeling" for the imbalance is the same among others who consider themselves fairly experienced. Maybe I'm just a rubbish FP?

I would contend that, certainly until considerably more time
has elapsed, any further attempts to boost the FP or reduce the powers of the DS would run a
severe danger of swinging the balance too far the other way.

Agree. I think we're taking in terms of tweaked setups for individual games here, rather than a revision of the standard set up.

Laurence G. Tilley

http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk

···

At 10:59 AM 02-10-01, Colin Forbes wrote:

#3

Something I noticed in my last game was that 2 of 12 Fp had more than one
character in their capital on turn 0. When I've played DS I almost always have
three characters in my capital. Makes a big difference on how fast addional
characters are added and is a big advantage.

David Gray

"Laurence G. Tilley" wrote:

···

So for want of reliable data, one has to use what's at hand - one's own
experience, however anecdotal the conclusions may appear. I find that when
I play DS I almost always win, and when I play FP I often lose. I'm
usually playing with the same people, or at least people of roughly
equivalent experience. When I've won as FP, I can't think of a single time
that I've thought the DS have played adequately. It's a bit disappointing
when you've celebrated victory then find out that the ClL had 4 agents, and
3 nations weren't talking to the others at all.

#4

I'm well known for whining and crying about the lack of stats in
this regard...Until those stats were made available. A number of
vets advised as to the approximate time when the supposed Big agent
"tweaks" were made, and after that point, nothing changed. The DS
just win most games.

One is unable to assume that the numbers get much better for grudge
games either. Even if one WAS to assume that, the overall stats
Include these grudge games, thus, if grudges were say, 50-50, then
the slant to the DS would be even WORSE the rest of the time....

Thus, the only remaining Challenge in 1650 is to win as a Freep
consistently......no?

BB

--- In mepbmlist@y..., Colin Forbes <colin@t...> wrote:

Hi,

Brad of the Clan Valadan wrote ...

> The DS have beaten the Free 2-1 over the long term.

Yes, I know (though it's more like 60-40 than 2-1) .. my point was

precisely that! The figures

show the trend over the long term - they do not reflect the changed

situation brought about by

alterations in agent rules etc etc. I would contend that, certainly

until considerably more time

has elapsed, any further attempts to boost the FP or reduce the

powers of the DS would run a

···

severe danger of swinging the balance too far the other way.

Colin.