Projects

What would you like us to put our time and effort into developing for the
game?

At present we have the autoinput project. Some accounting projects
(informing players if they are late with turns that sort of thing). Next
projects are reading pdf files and exporting that information to a map
making program (and for other players in your team). The website has been
updated at present and we are looking at more marketing opportunities (ie
more players)

Also a character listing program. Start with character list, then character
classes, location, capital hex, company commanders (and in a company), army
commanders (and in an army).

What else would you like to see? (Maybe no changes?)

My favourite long term project is creating variant games easily, with maps
created by players or zeroing in on certain areas.

This is a big topic I think. Thoughts welcome.

Clint

Hi---I'm not sure how much 'play' you have in
redisign, but I would love to see different strengths
considered for different classes of troops (I'm tired
of seeing heavy cav/heavy infantry all over the
place).
I was thinking of something along the lines of
reducing the heavy troops by 20% strength and
constitution totals, but leaving their maintenance
costs the same which essentially reduces the cost of
the lighter troop types in relation to the heavies).

Also to be considered would be greater factors used in
various terrains (bigger differentials for light
infantry vs. heavy infantry in mountains, for
instance).

Are any of these projects things that you could
consider, or are they too large to contemplate?

Joe Hayre 109958
--- Middle Earth PBM Games <me@MiddleEarthGames.com>
wrote:

···

What would you like us to put our time and effort
into developing for the
game?

At present we have the autoinput project. Some
accounting projects
(informing players if they are late with turns that
sort of thing). Next
projects are reading pdf files and exporting that
information to a map
making program (and for other players in your team).
The website has been
updated at present and we are looking at more
marketing opportunities (ie
more players)

Also a character listing program. Start with
character list, then character
classes, location, capital hex, company commanders
(and in a company), army
commanders (and in an army).

What else would you like to see? (Maybe no
changes?)

My favourite long term project is creating variant
games easily, with maps
created by players or zeroing in on certain areas.

This is a big topic I think. Thoughts welcome.

Clint

__________________________________________________
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Clint,

First of all I want to commend you for your effort regarding the autoinput.. I know people fear change, but in terms of the health of the game overall, this will make the game better in the long run.

The main project I think you all should be working on is to create a large scale marketing campaign to release in conjunction with the next edition of the movie. Figure out a way to reach your people... and a lot of them don't even know about MEPBM..

Anyway, if you want some ideas I can drop you a line.. let me know.. Ultimately I think the best way to improve the game will be to get more players... Which will also increase your bottom line, which will increase the amount you can put back into the game, and on and on and on...

Keep up the good work dude!

Chris

Hello Clint

  re: the character listing program.... could that, or does it,
involve the character portraits in any way? I know some time ago you
guys were discussing re-doing the portraits or at the very least
posting better scans of the existing pictures.

    perhaps this is something entirely different....

  it would be nice to have a library of characters with portraits
for people to choose from..... I think. Since I don't play, I really am
not sure of the process of how people choose their characters.

  just curious.
  Amelia
  ajames@artic.edu

--- In mepbmlist@y..., "Middle Earth PBM Games" <me@M...> wrote:

What would you like us to put our time and effort into developing for the
game?

..........

Also a character listing program. Start with character list, then character
classes, location, capital hex, company commanders (and in a company), army
commanders (and in an army).

...........

···

What else would you like to see? (Maybe no changes?)

This is a big topic I think. Thoughts welcome.

Clint

What would you like us to put our time and effort into developing for the
  game?

  At present we have the autoinput project. Some accounting projects
  (informing players if they are late with turns that sort of thing). Next
  projects are reading pdf files and exporting that information to a map
  making program (and for other players in your team). The website has been
  updated at present and we are looking at more marketing opportunities (ie
  more players)

  Also a character listing program. Start with character list, then character
  classes, location, capital hex, company commanders (and in a company), army
  commanders (and in an army).

  What else would you like to see? (Maybe no changes?)

  My favourite long term project is creating variant games easily, with maps
  created by players or zeroing in on certain areas.

  This is a big topic I think. Thoughts welcome.

  Clint
  RD: What happened to the (colour?) map you were going to do, like the glossy one in the startup pack but including all the starting pops (and ownwers?) and maybe starting armies/navies as well?

  Or was this project dropped for lack of support?

  Richard.

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

···

----- Original Message -----
  From: Middle Earth PBM Games
  To: mepbmlist
  Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:37 PM
  Subject: [mepbmlist] Projects

That is a nice idea!

···

----- Original Message -----
From: "ameliajames2" <ajames@artic.edu>
To: <mepbmlist@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 3:15 PM
Subject: [mepbmlist] Re: Projects

Hello Clint

re: the character listing program.... could that, or does it,
involve the character portraits in any way? I know some time ago you
guys were discussing re-doing the portraits or at the very least
posting better scans of the existing pictures.

  perhaps this is something entirely different....

it would be nice to have a library of characters with portraits
for people to choose from..... I think. Since I don't play, I really am
not sure of the process of how people choose their characters.

just curious.
Amelia
ajames@artic.edu

--- In mepbmlist@y..., "Middle Earth PBM Games" <me@M...> wrote:
> What would you like us to put our time and effort into developing for

the

> game?
..........

> Also a character listing program. Start with character list, then

character

> classes, location, capital hex, company commanders (and in a company),

army

> commanders (and in an army).
...........
>
> What else would you like to see? (Maybe no changes?)
>
> This is a big topic I think. Thoughts welcome.
>
> Clint

Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Clint,

I have a couple of ideas for you about changes to make or variant games.

1) As to turn format changes, I would like to see new pics for characters esp..4th age...I get rather tired of seeing elrond's face in every elven nation played...this doesn't enhance the overall outcome of any turn but would be a nice change of pace...I undertand we can submit our own pics for a substantial price....

2) As a variant to the game, use national unit strength modifiers…If the Khazad are supposed to be the miners,give them a bonus to production in mountains…or give their Heavy Infantry extra attack value or stamina…let the elven archers gain a bonus to their attack…make the Heavy Cav of the Long Rider, Easterlings, Dog Lord, Eothraim have bonuses…play to the strengths of the nations…I think it rather is unlikely this will occur, but some friends that play have suggested this to me in the past…almost forgot,give ents the ability to act like war machines against fortifications…stuff like that to liven up the game so that we don't all always recruit Heavy Infantry or Heavy Cav and nothing else…I would use other units if they had some value,if you could tweak that some to increase the desirability of varied units, that would be nice also…

3) Just a final note on turn setups....I was told before that neuts don't join together in games because they over balance the game...I'd like to add that in my limited experience the neuts join whoever is losing to even out the balance of the game or they flip to a side because they know players on a certain team...not that I disagree with that or whatever, I am not here to debate that....however, I do think that allowing 2 neuts to join together wouldn't be a game altering decision....gondors can join together...how can they not have the ultimate impact on a game if those that joined together work together as a single force?

I dare say you can't fine any parring of neutrals that would tip the balance of the game to a greater extent than having both gondors or for instance the doglord and dark lts joined as a team together...I just dont' see that neuts have that much impact....which is why I'd like to try and join w/ a buddy and see if we can work a gambit that makes them powerful...

just some thoughts, perhaps I'm daft, perhaps I'm genious incarnate...perhaps I need more beer...who knows...

I like the banter this kind of stuff generates so have at me guys....

J

···

----- Original Message -----
  From: Middle Earth PBM Games
  To: mepbmlist
  Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 11:37 AM
  Subject: [mepbmlist] Projects

  What would you like us to put our time and effort into developing for the
  game?

  At present we have the autoinput project. Some accounting projects
  (informing players if they are late with turns that sort of thing). Next
  projects are reading pdf files and exporting that information to a map
  making program (and for other players in your team). The website has been
  updated at present and we are looking at more marketing opportunities (ie
  more players)

  Also a character listing program. Start with character list, then character
  classes, location, capital hex, company commanders (and in a company), army
  commanders (and in an army).

  What else would you like to see? (Maybe no changes?)

  My favourite long term project is creating variant games easily, with maps
  created by players or zeroing in on certain areas.

  This is a big topic I think. Thoughts welcome.

  Clint

        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
       
  Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
  To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
  Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com

  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Persistent lobbying the game designers to get them to do a second edition - or to allow someone else to do a second edition. Readers who haven't seen the collected ideas for one might like to look in on http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk/2nded.htm

Like others, I'd also like to see more character portraits and the capacity for players to enter their own character portraits (no, not with a big surcharge).

Laurence G. Tilley

http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk

···

At 05:37 PM 09-04-02, you wrote:

What would you like us to put our time and effort into developing for the
game?

The main project I think you all should be working on is to create a large
scale marketing campaign to release in conjunction with the next edition of
the movie. Figure out a way to reach your people... and a lot of them
don't even know about MEPBM..

*** We found that advertising doesn't bring a lot of players. The main problem being that the generic confusion about what PBM is gets in the way of players joining up. When they do actually start playing a lot of them stick with it and bring their friends in.

There are lots of ways to deal with this. But thoughts welcome. (We've been here years so have probably heard it before though).

We just did a big flyer drop to the USA old players - we got around 30 players from that for example. We plan to contact old players of the game since we took over Allsorts that subsequently dropped the game. We've done adverts in Wargaming magasines as well - they worked okay. Conventions bring in around 30 players at Flagship. But still way the biggest is Word of Mouth.

When we get the game looking nice we want to target the computer games market but for now it does not look pretty enough.
Clint

That would take some reprogramming I am afraid. Something that at present we are working on colour turns. But that's a little way in the future. (At present rate anything from 6mths to 3 years)

Clint

···

At 19:15 09/04/02, you wrote:

Hello Clint

        re: the character listing program.... could that, or does it,
involve the character portraits in any way? I know some time ago you
guys were discussing re-doing the portraits or at the very least
posting better scans of the existing pictures.

        perhaps this is something entirely different....

        it would be nice to have a library of characters with portraits
for people to choose from..... I think. Since I don't play, I really am
not sure of the process of how people choose their characters.

        just curious.
        Amelia
        ajames@artic.edu

--- In mepbmlist@y..., "Middle Earth PBM Games" <me@M...> wrote:
> What would you like us to put our time and effort into developing for the
> game?
..........

> Also a character listing program. Start with character list, then character
> classes, location, capital hex, company commanders (and in a company), army
> commanders (and in an army).
...........
>
> What else would you like to see? (Maybe no changes?)
>
> This is a big topic I think. Thoughts welcome.
>
> Clint

Middle Earth PBM - hit reply to send to everyone
To Unsubscribe: http://www.yahoogroups.com
Website: http://www.MiddleEarthGames.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

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  Clint
  RD: What happened to the (colour?) map you were going to do, like the glossy one in the startup pack but including all the starting pops (and ownwers?) and maybe starting armies/navies as well?
*** We have one on our website that players can download and Oystein was working on another version much nicer (needs a bit of tidying up though).

  Or was this project dropped for lack of support?

*** I still have the list of players interested but it would cost too much with such a small player base wanting it. Roughly £20 each.

Clint

I have a couple of ideas for you about changes to make or variant games.

*** Always interesting. Note we do get quite a lot of variant ideas for games. Most are not thought out particularly well though I am afraid (game balance, desirability etc). We'll support a new game variant if you can get half the players - we'll attempt to get the rest. But the more variants the more diluted the player base. (For example I have around 20 positions filled in the Last Alliance game but can't get it past that despite months of trying).

Variant games also take more effort on our part and the players part. Richard Devereux's scenarios are pretty good. Some balance issues might need to be addresses, same for desirability of nations but basically correct. Gunboat is good as well - ideal for the "want to play another game but not got the time for diploming." Okay before I go too much into spin the basic idea is if we can support it we will.

As for program changes we can't do them. We can house rule specific games and advertise them - eg the NKA and LAS FA scenarios where the coding hasn't been changed but certain actions are prohbited.

1) As to turn format changes, I would like to see new pics for characters esp..4th age...I get rather tired of seeing elrond's face in every elven nation played...this doesn't enhance the overall outcome of any turn but would be a nice change of pace...I undertand we can submit our own pics for a substantial price....

** See earlier post to Amelia.

2) As a variant to the game, use national unit strength modifiers…If the Khazad are supposed to be the miners,give them a bonus to production in mountains…or give their Heavy Infantry extra attack value or stamina…let the elven archers gain a bonus to their attack…make the Heavy Cav of the Long Rider, Easterlings, Dog Lord, Eothraim have bonuses…play to the strengths of the nations…I think it rather is unlikely this will occur, but some friends that play have suggested this to me in the past…almost forgot,give ents the ability to act like war machines against fortifications…stuff like that to liven up the game so that we don't all always recruit Heavy Infantry or Heavy Cav and nothing else…I would use other units if they had some value,if you could tweak that some to increase the desirability of varied units, that would be nice also…

*** Nice but be careful. Having more complexity is okay for old hands at the game but for new players makes the confusion grow (and hence more likely to not even get back in touch with us never mind not get a turn in!)

3) Just a final note on turn setups....I was told before that neuts don't join together in games because they over balance the game...I'd like to add that in my limited experience the neuts join whoever is losing to even out the balance of the game or they flip to a side because they know players on a certain team...not that I disagree with that or whatever, I am not here to debate that....however, I do think that allowing 2 neuts to join together wouldn't be a game altering decision....gondors can join together...how can they not have the ultimate impact on a game if those that joined together work together as a single force?

*** Um not my experience (as GM and player). In your example say Cor/Har join the losing side then we have a game altering impact on the game. (As a player Game 83 was very much like that - where I as the Cor, helped convince the Duns and Eas to join the losing side of the FPs - the game has changed. Note I did not join losing side for other than totally in-game reasons! 10 diplos from the Fp for every one off the DS who were busy building up troops to "defend" themselves.)

···

I like the banter this kind of stuff generates so have at me guys....
*** Check above... :slight_smile:
J

Outside our present remit I am afraid.

Clint

···

Hi---I'm not sure how much 'play' you have in
redisign, but I would love to see different strengths
considered for different classes of troops (I'm tired
of seeing heavy cav/heavy infantry all over the
place).
Are any of these projects things that you could
consider, or are they too large to contemplate?

Joe Hayre 109958

Persistent lobbying the game designers to get them to do a second edition -
or to allow someone else to do a second edition.

*** We have done this sort of thing. It would really be upto the players to do it - sort of a "Friend of Middle Earth"
  style campaign... :slight_smile:

Like others, I'd also like to see more character portraits and the capacity
for players to enter their own character portraits (no, not with a big
surcharge).

*** I am aware that some players consider the charges to be high. What would be considered a fair price?

1) To specifically choose a portrait image for your nation.
2) To put a new image into the database? This won't be used for general use though (a sort of quality control-part of the program).

I would estimate 1) to take us 5 hours to get the 1st one working (we've been here before this is accurate), subsequent ones 2 hours, then down to 20 minutes for the final version when we have it sorted.

Thanks
Clint

No charge. You'd have to improve/write the software to make it simple and quick for someone to send you a graphic file (or specified type and size), so that it could be imported into the program with minimal effort, or perhaps select a code number from a catalogue of images which could then be given as an entry in the NamChar order:

725 NamChar Susie the Jacuzzi F C10 A10 E10 M0 #69
where "#69" is the image required.

Laurence G. Tilley

http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk

···

At 05:16 PM 10-04-02, you wrote:

*** I am aware that some players consider the charges to be high. What
would be considered a fair price?

1) To specifically choose a portrait image for your nation.
2) To put a new image into the database? This won't be used for general
use though (a sort of quality control-part of the program).

I would estimate 1) to take us 5 hours to get the 1st one working (we've
been here before this is accurate), subsequent ones 2 hours, then down to
20 minutes for the final version when we have it sorted.

This is unlikely to work at we do more work and get paid less. :slight_smile: Basically if a player asks us to something outside of the normal remit of the game I think that a charge for that service is fair and appropriate. It keeps the fees down for players who don't ask for more.

A prime example are reprinting turns. We have noticed a large decline in reprints when we informed players that they would have to pay for them. Same for phone-in charges. (Ie time and resource consumers endeavours in both cases - there are many other examples). Either you are saying that we should be paid less for the work (we still have to get the games out hence more work with more services) or do more work for the same amount of money. Sorry - no thanks.

By your argument special variant games should cost the same as normal games. Am I correct? I think that would effectively kill off running any variant games.

>*** I am aware that some players consider the charges to be high. What

>would be considered a fair price?

No charge. You'd have to improve/write the software to make it simple and
quick for someone to send you a graphic file (or specified type and size),
so that it could be imported into the program with minimal effort, or
perhaps select a code number from a catalogue of images which could then be
given as an entry in the NamChar order:

*** Buy GSI out then it can be done. Otherwise it ain't happening.

Clint

A poor business approach if you reject all game development suggestions as blithely as that. There are certain basic commodities that always have value - food, wood, water. But you're not selling those, you're selling an entertainment product. Specifically, you're selling a rather dated and much flawed old pbm game. If you fail to invest in order to keep an entertainment product fresh and attractive, sooner or later your customers will find something better somewhere else.

Laurence G. Tilley

http://www.lgtilley.freeserve.co.uk

···

At 11:41 PM 10-04-02, you wrote:

This is unlikely to work at we do more work and get paid less.

>This is unlikely to work at we do more work and get paid less.

A poor business approach if you reject all game development suggestions as
blithely as that.

Um - not sure how to answer that. :slight_smile:

Clint