Game 68 All Neutral

Even my armies??? :smiley:

Anyway mine will be busy soon. There is a certain pest that has overstayed his welcome in and around the Rhun Sea. :stuck_out_tongue:

Ian
LR

You say it as if ā€œlike thisā€ is a bad thing; I wouldnā€™t have it any other way!

I took a page out of Clintā€™s strategy book and named all emissaries. <g>

Bah Dragon Lord, cry me a river why donā€™t you. Iā€™m sure the elves have a few harps to play ā€˜Oh how my heart bleeds for you.ā€™ You acted first in hostility. You should thank me for ridding of you of one so incompetent. Celedhring tried to kill one of my subjects, he had what was coming to him. Donā€™t worry, I hear your pain and Iā€™m coming to end it.

Cheers!

Good grief Mr Duns you really do twist things around dont you i would say comeing to my pop centre uninvited was the first act of aggression here ,im sure any agent carrying the ring of wind doesnt just drop by for a cup of tea now does he? but im fine with that. you will find that i am much betterd prepared for a fight than the poor double crossed rhudaur so bring it on you and the rest of your western bully boys ,The woodman is dead and i need a new battleground you will do nicely.
KIZER

HA HA, you of all people calling the kettle black with twisting things. Celedhring tried to kill one of my characters and then stole Tinculin, he has now paid for his crimes. I am sure you have tried to prepare. Like I told your lackey, the Sinda, come west and you will find the same fate as the Rhudaur and the Noldo.

As for us being the bully, Iā€™m sure the Woodmen are turning in their grave to hear you bleat such profane innocence. :slight_smile:

If youā€™re going to complain, at least be truthful about the complaint: you tried to kill and failed, I tried and succeeded.

-Corbin

I am nothing but truthfull(well mostly) you really should get your intel correct. I suggest you do a LAT for i did not steal Tinc and as for challengeing yep i think anyone out in the open looking for artis is fair game.The Woodman and me went head to head with no interference from any other nation i did not need the help of the cardolan and witch king to defeat one betrayed and deceived nation all of you must be so proud of your achievements im sure.As i said bring it on im not complaining just waiting.
KIZER

How dare you accuse me of pride! A deadly sin, and the purview of men, I have not been a practicioner since the life was let out of me in the Younger Ages. You mistake the Urge to Power for pride, and it is unbecoming of a Nazgul to prattle on with such moralizing. I renounce you as my brethren. May Illuvatar also find worth in your violent death, as you whimper like an elf in some arboreal tomb.
Murazor, Leader of the Eight.

Dearest Dragon Dude,

Donā€™t you think itā€™s a bit of mis-information to say that you and woodmen went it alone head-to-head? werenā€™t you in cahoots with Sinda? Wasnā€™t it a wee-bit comforting to realize that you could go all-out against woodmen without worrying about Sinda attacking your vulnerable spots? And wasnā€™t there a whole heaping helping of misinformational spin from you and Sinda about how you were going to attack each otherā€¦ but never didā€¦ Hmmmā€¦ did you have any other ā€œdealsā€ in place? with EO for example? he has remarkably left you and your woody-conquest-focus aloneā€¦ Mayhaps you, Sinda, and EO are all working together? And hmmm, what about Dwarves? he has also left you aloneā€¦ I think thereā€™s much more to this than you claim.

So, you should have said that the ā€œtruth doesnā€™t get in the way of your spin.ā€ And for the record, if you attacked one of my characters (artifact hunting or whatever), Iā€™d consider it that you threw the first stone. No wonder Duns are going after youā€¦ Reap what you sow.

Oh, and as to this whole hoopla about us ganging up on Rhu. Rhu, Noldo & DW (and WK if theyā€™d been successful in recruiting him) were going to gang up on Arth, so whatā€™s wrong with us ganging up on Rhu? or Noldo? Nothing. It is war after allā€¦

Your friendly Cardolan editor of misinformational Dragon-dude spin,
Dave

Well i guess thats all 3 of the western bully boys that have had a pop at me. I care little for any of it as id expect you to back up your little dun heap. the goings on in mirkwood are the business of the mirkwood nations and you can speculate all you like about how it is. Il say it again believe it or not but i had no help in taking out the woodman , only he can verify that i guess. So stop the chatter and as ive said already bring it on , im of to watch karate kid to learn how to give bullys a bloody nose and thats what your all gonna get.
KIZER

Canā€™t they see? Donā€™t they realize the distinction between war and foul betrayal? If the ā€œmenā€ of Cardolan truly canā€™t see the difference, then they are no longer truly men.

What your alliance did was to lie, deceive, and make false promises in order to gain a meaningless tactical advantage. Why? 3 to 1 wasnā€™t enough of an advantage already?

Rhudaur actively sought allies in the region, INCLUDING the Arthedain (who refused to answer). The WK was quite enthusiastic about attacking Arthedain, (though we all know now it was yet another in his endless string of lies). Even on the brink of war, I stated to the WK that I would prefer to include Arthedain if he ever decided to respond. I never allied with the Arthedain and then stabbed him in the back. That is the purview of YOUR alliance.

And before the ā€œmenā€ of Cardolan protest their innocence regarding the betrayal by the worm of the north, let me remind them that they not only decided to disregard such betrayal, but these self-same ā€œmenā€ actively and enthusiastically supported the ultimate betrayer. Innocent? Hardly! Their hands are very, VERY far from clean.

Arfanhil,
Rhudar in exile

Dearest Defeated Arfanhil,

What one member of our alliance did was to make false promises in order to gain advantage. Please make up your mind. You canā€™t have it both ways. Either each member of an alliance is responsible for their alliesā€™ lies & deceit (which you claim Cardolan should be vis-a-vis WK) or they arenā€™t (which you claim implicitly in touting your own innocence, when you were a partner of Noldo - notorious liar and slanderer).

My own view is that I canā€™t control other nations. Mayhaps you believe you can?

Also, if you and WK and Noldo had allied vs. Arth, hmmm, wouldnā€™t that have been 3:1? (Iā€™ll spot you that Dwarves were unaligned initially) And your alliance was versus Arth as your and Noldoā€™s opening turns indicateā€¦ So, apparently there is a nice advantage in numbers (meaning perhaps that itā€™s not so meaningless afterall)

Revealing yet more spin,
Your buddies in Cardolan

All moot really. The whole point of the All Neutral game was to provide a venue for this type of diplomatic shenanigans. ME Survivor, if you will. Trust nobody at any time. If you work together for the whole game, good on you. If your ā€œallyā€ turns on you on turn 18, well, good on them. Nothing can be personal here - an Honour Free Zone if you will.

Ren, expecting to be disassembled by friends anytime nowā€¦

Quite true Brad.

Though I do have extra wood here in Dunland in case Arfanhil finds the cross heā€™s climbed onto just isnā€™t big enough for his desires.

Enion

LOL. Yes Brad.

Part of whatā€™s fun about this game is trying to decipher all of the diplomatic shenanigans - either in individual emails, or from whatā€™s posted on this boardā€¦

But whatā€™s mostest and truliest the most splendiforous fun (to quote Tigger) is to expose the shenanigans and twisted ā€œlogicā€ of the various postings. It is indeed my icing on the cake in this particular game.

Speaking of diplomatic shenanigans, we Northwest types welcome diplomacy with all of you who arenā€™t openly our enemies (that would exclude Noldo, DW, Sinda, DragonDude, Corsairs, and whatā€™s left of Rhu if anything) Iā€™m not sure if EO is allied with DragonDude, but would have to assume so since heā€™s left him alone to his nefarious plans against Woodmen. So, even if you just want to hoot and holler at us or call our ancesters names, give us an email occasionally!

Dave

Brad, I just love your sense of humour. Is that a dagger I see before me?

On another note iā€™m opening up a book on how long the Eothraim are likely to live. Turn 15 is already taken ;o)

Din

This, coming from the MASTER of such. The Cardolan continually twist the words of others in an effort to make themselves look less unreasonable.

I never claimed that the Cardolan had any control whatsoever over the WK. (Indeed, the WK seems to have all the control in that alliance.) I said that the Cardolan continually attempts to claim innocence while happily PROFITING from the WKā€™s behavior. One canā€™t be innocent if one chooses to lie down with vipers of their own free will, no matter how much one might twist and obfuscate the facts.

As for the rest, such is the way of things. While disappointing to be on the short end of such a foul stick, I have stated from the start that I accept that there are (unfortunately) players out there who spit on diplomacy as just a tool of subterfuge. So be it. My mission now is simply to keep reminding all other leaders in Middle-earth that the diplomacy of the NW alliance should be taken in a very, VERY, skeptical light. That goes for ANYONE in that alliance. (If they condone it in their allies, then how far can they be trusted?)

Arfanhil,
Rhudar in Exile

Why thank you Arfanhil,

It is nice to be given the title of ā€œMasterā€ by oneā€™s defeated opponent. Given that our alliance now controls all that was once Rhudaur, it is entirely appropriate that you finally recognize the way of things and cede that we are your ā€œMaster.ā€ Itā€™s too bad that you had to qualify the term, but we will continue to work with you on your acceptance of the new reality.

To one and all,

Certainly there is a heaping helping of ā€œdiplomatic shenanigansā€ in the negotiations that are ongoing in the constantly shifting alliances and wars that rage in Middle Earth. Nonetheless, we of the Northwest Alliance do welcome diplomacy and communication with others. We will be wary of your promises (until proven by data or deed) just as you will be wary of ours. We understand that is the nature of this vast conflict. And we would point out that we have made no deal or promise post the WKā€™s initial treachery that has not been kept. If it is not crystal clear, let me make it so. Our enemies are the Noldo, Dwarves, Sinda and Dragon Lord and their allies (veiled or not).
We welcome discussion and negotiations with all other nations. Bring on the diplomatic shenanigans! let the spin begin!

The Spin ā€œMastersā€ of Cardolan

I am just happy to have all the control in the alliance AND iā€™m a viper. Vipers are almost as cool as weasels and way cooler than just being a snake.
Ganier the Worm

This is a unique game. So unique that we have FP & DS nations allied together, see above for example. If this game was played on the usual 10v10 with the neuts joining a side then I would of been very dissapointed.

What we have is a 1 off game that everyone is in it for themselves. Itā€™s basically the Wild West come to Middle Earth.

If there wasnā€™t any ā€œShenanigansā€ or ā€œBack Stabbingsā€ or even ā€œFront Stabbingsā€ at the game start then I would of been extreemly dissapointed. Heck even I had to decide upon Easterlings or Eothraim and in the end I believe I chose the right way while leading the other up the garden path.

This sure is one fun game ;o)

Ian
LR